Olympic dream ends in epic collapse
- by Paul Kennedy @pkedit, Mar 26, 2012
[USA-EL SALVADOR] In the long history of the men's national team program, there has never been a monumental goalkeeping error at such a crucial moment as Sean Johnson's failure to hold on to Jaime Alas' shot from distance in the fifth minute of stoppage time of the USA-El
Salvador game in Nashville, Tenn., on Monday night. Johnson will be remembered as the goat of the match that ended 3-3 and with it the USA's dream of going to the Olympics, but he was hardly the only
one to blame for the epic collapse.
NIGHTMARE ENDING. At least five players share the blame of Alas' tying goal. The trouble began at exactly the 4:00
minute mark of stoppage time when Brek Shea -- a starter on the senior national team -- played an aimless ball into midfield where a comedy of errors
followed.
First, Mix Diskerud and Michael Stephens ran into themselves trying to take the ball from Alas,
and when El Salvador lost the ball, Amobi Okugo kicked it straight to Herbert Sosa. Three times the USA had the chance
to kill the game, and three times it failed.
Sosa laid the ball off to Alas, who was off to the races. Okugo couldn't keep up and Ike Opara was
late coming out, allowing Alas to shoot unchallenged from 24 yards out. Yes, it was a speculative shot, but Alas' shot was hit hard, bounced in front of Johnson and ate him up. At first, it looked
like the ball might pop over the crossbar but it spun over Johnson's left shoulder and into the goal.
ATROCIOUS DEFENDING. Johnson was only in the game because starter Bill Hamid left with a ankle injury suffered in the first half, but Hamid wasn't subbed before he
gave up two goals that wiped out the first-minute U.S. lead.
As it was throughout the tournament, the U.S. defending was atrocious. The USA was supposed to have a huge advantage in size
over the Salvadorans, but that mattered little because no one marked. Just like against Canada, the USA's defending on set pieces was horrible. And Lester
Blanco scored on a header to the near post off a corner kick, beating three Americans to the ball.
Two minutes later, things got worse. As he was on both plays leading up to the
first-half goals, Jorge Villafana was beaten down his left side. Perry Kitchen coughed up an easy ball, and seconds
later Opara could not clear. That allowed Alas to play a ball through the area to the far post where Andres Flores, kept onside by Opara, snuck behind Villafana
for the easiest of goals.
Only minutes earlier, Hamid had hurt his ankle diving for a ball. Could he have stopped either goal? Maybe, maybe not. But should he have been taken out of the
game? No doubt.
LA SELECTA REWARDED. The stunning result from Monday's opening game had dropped Canada into second place and meant the USA or El
Salvador would win the group and (in all likelhood) avoid Mexico in the semifinals. This turn of events was taken as good news for the USA but was a motivator as well for El Salvador, which had the
advantage of being in a position to capture Group A with a win or tie.
Yes, the USA deserved credit for coming back from 2-1 down to take the lead on goals by Terrence Boyd, his second of the game, and a goal by Joe Corona, but the fact is, La Selecta was the better team on the
night.
What would have happened if Mexican referee Roberto Garcia had seen Salvadoran defender Alexander Lardin punch Boyd in the nose -- in the penalty
area no less -- and sent him off late in the second half? We'll never know. What we do know is the Salvadorans were moved to tears by the outcome, and they celebrated with the pro-Salvadoran crowd --
in Nashville of all places.
LOST OPPORTUNITY. The whole U.S. Soccer top brass was on hand at LP Field, and no one will be more disappointed with the
USA's exit than national team coach Jurgen Klinsmann. He was on the West Germany team that went to the 1988 Olympics in Seoul, and he credits its run with
building the momentum that led to its World Cup title two years later.
For a young team needing international experience -- and at least five other under-23 players who could have been
recalled for the Summer Olympics had been left in Europe -- it was a big opportunity lost.
As it was, few of the U-23s Coach Caleb Porter brought
in acquitted themselves well. Can you say anyone helped his reputation in Nashville? Perhaps Corona and Boyd with six goals between them, but even they were invisible in the 2-0 loss to Canada.
The wing play in the favored 4-3-3 was poor, the midfield was beaten badly in both the Canada and El Salvador games, and as for the backline? Well, if Klinsmann was looking for help for his
aging backline, he certainly wasn't going to find it from the U-23s' wretched back four.
No, don't blame Sean Johnson. He wasn't alone.
March 26
in Nashville, Tenn.
USA 3 El Salvador 3. Goals: Boyd 1, 64, Corona 69; Blanco 35, Flores 37, Alas 90.
USA -- Hamid (Johnson 39); Sarkodie, Opara, Kitchen, Villafana; Diskerud, Okugo, Corona (Stephens 88); Adu (Gyau 90), Boyd, Shea.
El Salvador -- Y.Cuellar, Molina, Garcia, Mendoza, Chavarria (Ceren 73), Gutierrez, Alas, Larin, Menjivar, Blanco (Sosa 86), Flores.
Referee: Roberto Garcia (Mexico).
Att.: 7,889.
Thankyou CUBA!
Whats the excuse this time??
Maybe if the powers that be understood that picking a goalkeeper is not about size and strength we may still be alive. Hamid allowed a goal vs Canada that made his 6'3" look 5'3" then today Sean Johnson looked like a u12 girl trying to complete the most important routine save of his career. When you pick a goalkeeper you look for nerve, competitive instincts and the ability to win games. Instead our US national coaches pick keepers like they're waitibg outside the nfl and nba combines to see who doesn't get drafted and offer them a spot on the national team.
a reliable goalkeeper is a huge part of the over success of the team.
Hamid and Johnson have never won anything significant and have not proved that they can win at any level.
I know it's U23 but I really feel that we need to look at more than physique when choosing a goalkeeper
Lots of mistakes all around. Hamid and Johnson sucked, Porter made mistakes during the whole tourney with his lineups, tonight pulling Corona and Adu for no good reason seals the deal! Also, too bad the intentional forearm to the head in the PK area was missed by the referee and linesmen.
3-5-2
Once again it is clear that U S soccer's policy of picking big, strong players ahead of technical, tactical players is a mistake and this time leads to being eliminated from a huge international tournament in the first round. Until U S Soccer changes their focus we don't have a hope on the world stage. US SOCCER, LOOK AT SPAIN OR CLOSER TO HOME MEXICO!!! These are not huge men.
When will US soccer learn that big strong players can be easily nullified by superior technical ability. We should not be picking soccer players like we do linebackers. The best club team in the world is arguably Barca and they are all fairly small but wonderfully technical players.
The American's inability to kill the game in the final minutes (not just the final 60 seconds) was an embarrassment. The players repeatedly made bad choices that ultimately cost them the game. Inexperienced players with an inexperienced (at the international level) coach...in any other country, the coach would be fired.
when you name a college coach to take on the challenge of international soccer don't be surprised when he picks a bunch of top heavy athletes over soccer players. call up a college coach and tell him you have a great player you would like to recommend. The first question after "what academy does he play for?" is "how big is he?" .... D1 soccer is crazy, fast paced, physical game where bigger-faster-stronger might be more effective than smart, quick and highly skilled.
Looking at this team from goalkeeper to up top, Porter may have fallen into that trap where you think size is important. Also, enough with these military-base babies from Germany. It hurts team unity and keeps a home grown talent off the off the field.
Organizing the back-4, maintaining defensive shape...huge HUGE liabilities in the "American" game. The technical speed and creativity of international opposition exposes this weakness time and again.
this is my story an I am sticking to it...the USA will never be a soccer power until we get into our heads, we have to develope players based upon skill, NOT
THIS IS MY STORY AN I AM STICKING TO IT....the USA will never be a soccer power until we understand, we have to develope players based upon basic skills NOT based upon their financial status an ability to pay to play...we all have seen the player that excels in the sport, that has not been to expensive clubs, toured tournaments, etc...because he just can not afford it, otherwise, his parents could not...thus, my reasoning for ALL MLS teams to be required to have youth academies that house, train young players to be sport specific in soccer. Scout young players an pay for their room an board, let them attend public schools nearby, then, train them, play them in tournaments, etc...bring them up to play the game the way it should be played...without all the political, monetary influence. Plain an simple, just get the best players together. Other countries do it, why can't the USA?? So many in the USA think that size is all that matters, as if they were thinking of Rugby..or the NFL or NBA...not the case in soccer...the best ie. of this is take a look at Barcelona...enough said?
The question is,how many Academy players did El Salvador have?Shouldn't we have won then with our far "superior" academy programs?The recent problems with our youth national teams is now appearing at the senior levels.What the academies are producing are highly trained super athletic robots.Perfect for the college game where the coaches make all the decisions for the players and can sub players in and out.Where are the thinkers?No wonder Klnsi is bringing in foreign based and trained players.We won't see much better until the current youth system is changed and the next batch of youth players (now U 9 and 10) come through a better system. I hope Jurgen ha a long term contract.
Had usa had a better goalie, they would have won the game by 1 but would have still been outplayed by more tecnical and hungrier Salvadorians. This should be the only focus. How can a country that is 60 times smaller have so many better players or even come close to Usa? There is absolutely no excuse for this. We can talk about goalkeeping and tactics all day but it is very clear that the biggest problem continues to be the player selection system in place. Porter could only pick sp many players from the pool presented to him by scouts. Who is in charge of these scouts and are they held accountable for players they miss or ignore?? There were 2 Usa born players on this Salvadorian team. Too many Hispanic Usa players are going to play for other countries. Hispanics in the American Continent have shown time and time again to be the more tecnical soccer players only because this is the #1 sport of choice for them. Lets stop coming up with excuses like, oh this is the 3rd sport in usa, and pick the players that have long made it its 1st choice in Usa.
Criticism of the academy is unjustified at this early stage. Significant structural obstacles will continue to impede its true objective, but the academy system has begun to assign the task of youth development to MLS clubs, which is a big step in the right direction. Very few on the u-23 roster were Academy players. Failures of our youth national teams continue to highlight the fact that we aren't developing players that have the talents to play the game at higher levels. Particularly when matched up against players their own age, our guys don't look good enough. We are facing a very difficult future after Donovan and Dempsey retire.
Good job Academies!! The idea behind these Academies is that if a great player trains with high level talent they will excel but npbody looks at the other more important factors like what is the Academies #1 priority, player development or winning the most games?? Winning the most games is the easy choice because this is what is monetarily rewarding for them. The top players in these Academies have almost always been developed in smaller clubs and only there for 1-2 years. Academies show a much greater effort in recruiting top players than making them. They do this because they want to win vs other Academis and not to further develop them. Stronger, bigger and faster players are the ones they scout to win especially at the younger ages. If player development was a first then all Academy players would at least get a full game of playing time or played up to further challebge the better players. This is not the case. The better players at the moment will get the playing time and will play their age only to secure the wins and saved for the next appropriate age game to win some more. There is money in wins. No money in player development. Pay to play. Win to charge more.
Gak, so you believe are current youth is inferior to El Salvadors??
Comfort on the ball, abilitity to handle pressure without panicking, possession and simple play are things we can't do because the seeds of negativity are planted at the U-9 level and reinforced at the high school level.
Giveaways are too many, i.e., Fire v Union MLS contest ahd 33 unforced giveaways by both teams when even in the lower bracket of the EPL are much less.
Gak, I agree, that the Academy system is the way to go, but not as it is currently structured. Only MLS teams and top pro clubs should have Academies,and they should be free for the players.US soccer should subsidize the MLS and Pro clubs to a certain extent to be sure they devote substantial resources to the training and development of youth players.In addition, smaller local clubs must be brought into the system.The MLS and Pro clubs should have territories assigned to them to work with the local youth clubs to establish scouting,training and reporting programs.Also,the local youth clubs should be assisted financially by the MLS and Pro clubs according to the number of players selected for the Academy programs from the clubs.This is the way to bring everyone on board. An integrated system using ALL our resources with everyone on the same page
Walt, but that would be the correct way to do it. Too much to ask from this current greedy system. Too many rules need to be changed. You and me are drinking crazy pills, my friend.
Amen Luis, it might be the "crazy pills",but we'll keep taking them until there is a cure. We just care too much.
It does not matter whether we have college coaches, academies, ban on high school playing etc. We will not be a soccer power until we have everyone in the US on the edge of their seats watching and willing their national teams to victory. All readers excepted, how many citizens even knew that their U23 national team was vying for an Olympic berth? How many of US were rooting for Cuba to score the equalizer against Canada? It does not matter whether players are big or small, it matters that they have the national conscience willing them on. Unfortunately for the US it is the case of which came first, the chicken or the egg? If the national team were champions, they would have national backing. We would have people playing in the streets, down the halls of offices and schools. Every small advance that the US makes is a step in the right direction, and is something to build on. The US is different, and we fans must remain positive, and cheer our successes, and cry in our beers at our losses. All of El Salvador willed that ball to the net. What an entertaining game the jogo bonito is.
This is one of the lowest moments ever for US Soccer and anybody who pretends otherwise is in complete denial.
I don't know where to start.
I attended the U23 warmup game in Frisco against Mexico and I don't understand what happened between then and now. The US team looked confident, fluid and in control in that game. Traits that were completely missing in Nashville.
After watching the last two games I hope that there is nobody who really believes that things are OK in US Soccer youth development or that our talent pool is anything but what it is. Everybody has their own opinion about what needs to change. Mine is that US Soccer will not change for at least one more generation, despite the PR coming from Chicago, because there are too many dinosaurs that have to go away before change will be truly accepted and too much money made at all levels of youth and college soccer for any change to happen. The dinosaurs and other people pigging out at this trough will not go away (or give control and money for youth development to MLS-where it belongs) easily. Everybody in this cash grab game will find somebody else to point the fingers at, other than themselves, for the abject humiliation of constantly losing to countries like El Salvador, Canada and Guatemala. Nobody is going to give up their cushy gigs without a serious fight and it will take many years of people like Klinsmann, Reyna and Ramos beating at the system (and a lot of people to retire) for any change to happen.
I was mystified at the seletion of Caleb Porter for this job when it happened. I won't pile on about how overmatched he was. He did himself in with his absurd guarantee that the US would win last night. This one is on Klinsmann. He picked him and should be held accountable. This is by no means a statement that Klinsmann needs to go; if anything this result proves his beliefs that we are really behind the international curve.
Finally, the soccer community (if there is one) in Tennessee ought to be ashamed of themselves for their pathetic support of this tournament. When are we going to finally learn our lesson that major international tournaments like this should be played in MLS cities in front of fans that will show up. I have no idea why Nashville was selected. Maybe the IOC was in charge and chose Nashville because they believed it would be a neutral site. The soccer community of Nashville sure proved that to be correct didn't they?
Jeffrey, thoroughly agree on the lack of support for the US in the tournament, althought I too wonder who was responsible for choosing Nashville. But as to Porter, I will not judge him yet. Certainly he was caught with his pants down against Canada, but I liked his setup and tactical approach last night, and I actually think his confidence was a positive, not a negative.
The defense was a nightmare and has been all along and at many levels..individual defensive decisions involving identification and proper marking are pathetic. Two examples in this game are letting the opponent get inside position on a near post run to head a cross (the opponent, subsequently, gets his head to the ball first and scores)...2nd, how can a opponent be unmarked and not tracked back into the box??? is there any communication out there amongst the defenders?? What is the first job of the defenders??? I do not consider this a failure but just another evaluation process and a time to reflect on what we need to work on..It is not that complicated...good defense is easy to teach and is fundamental...poor defense is costing the US a lot of goals...if you want to do something difficult then try to "teach" someone to be a Messi, Inesta, Ronaldo, etc.
Youth development in the US is a disaster and from the evidence the Academy system is making it worse. To a person coaches will say size doesn't matter, it's the player's skill. And to a person they'll go and pick players whose main skill is their size. Yeah it's been said a million times but the game last night was exhibit A - we were absolutely worked last night by a smaller and more technical team our stars were supposed to dominate. Can you imagine if we had made the Olympics and had to play even better teams?
We are not getting the best athletes. The war is lost because the battles are taking place in the high schools where the best athletes are still playing football and basketball. You can take not the best athlete and dress them nicely and put them on an Academy team and train them with the US Soccer manual but if he comes up against the best athlete from El Salvador or England or wherever they are going to lose - it's men against boys.
Roy, the problem isn't merely poor teaching and fundamentals -- at the international level you need good natural instincts, composure and technical skills as well. The US defenders we saw last night have none of the above -- Opara, Kitchen and Villafana are simply not qualified to wear US colors. I've been mystified for some time about what anyone saw in Opara, who plays for my hometown Quakes in San Jose. Deliberately letting that simple little ball roll past his foot on the second goal was a moment of supreme embarrassment. Hopefully we'll never see him again at the US level.
Gordon, we have plenty of athletes. We don't lack for athleticism... we have plenty of big, strong, fast players. What we lack is footballing skill and sophistication.
We need to re-examine what we mean by "best athlete". What it generally means in the US is the biggest, strongest and fastest. There are other attributes that more enlightened countries look for when evaluating athletes - quickness (not the same as speed), agility, fine motor control and balance/body control. These traits seem to appear more in the smaller or at least later-maturing kids but because of their early size disadvantage we eliminate them from elite levels at 12 or 13. This isn't anything that hasn't been said a thousand times before but last night was a great example, watching our big athletes who no doubt had been on top teams since they were 9 get completely worked over by smaller, more agile players.
Mike, I agree with your comments but there is a defensive problem that is systemic in this country...we don't do a good job of teaching good individual defensive decision making (assuming we have good athletes). I recognize that great defense will only get you a tie in a game and that you still need to score a goal to win...but the US (versus Brazil, Argentina, Spain - granted some of the best teams in the world - over the last 2 years) cannot defend and players make pathetic defensive decisions.
Mike, everyone thinks we have these 'athletic' players but we really don't compared to the best of the best from other countries. Until we have 'Charles Barkley' in goal we are not going to make it.
I agree the skill and sophistication needs to improve also and I think we get middle to upper class players that are not as hungry and coachable as others.
Guys,we need soccer players,no matter what the size.Our current youth system is not developing them.Who has the power to change it?That's where the problem is.
Mike, I am not as high on Porter as you are. In any event, there really isn't a job for a U23 coach for another 3 years anyway. He can go back to Akron or maybe go get a job where he can actually develop some international experience if he is serious about continuing.
Xavi, how can you say that the Academy system is making things worse? This U23 pool has nothing to do with the Academy. Regardless, the Academy is already operating with one hand tied behind it's back because it is not competely tied in with professional clubs in US and we continue to have these absurd arguments about how Johnny can continue to play for his high school and be a world class international at the same time.
I clearly see the issue is with those that identify and select players for the national teams and professional teams. I have worked with some of the most skilled youth players in the world...and they were American. The problem is while they had all the technical quality of the best Europeans or South Americans, they were not given the opportunity to progress in a biased, egotistical and political pyramid system. I could easily pick 11 Hispanic or 11 African American or 11 White players who could go to Chelsea FC in London and beat their best U19s or U17s but the issue is, who cares? People in the US structure are very close knit and only listen to those they know well. That is why Bruce Arena dominates MLS and US Soccer coaching hires when clearly his entourage is the worse for identifying talent. Until we get rid of these cronies, America will always be pathetic losers in football.
Everyone commenting is missing one important part of U.S. Soccer that needs to get the blame for the lack of player development in the country. Yes, the Academies are failing, yes, there are too many dinosaurs involved with youth soccer and making all of the money. But, the part of US Soccer that always gets a pass and is always worshipped by parents, players, etc. but NEVER gets any blame for the quality of its play is College Soccer. The style of play in college soccer is HORRIBLE, and the games are boring. Although it has changed a little (for the better), the style is still play slow, stand around, and kick and run to win at all cost. There is no development in college soccer because coaches believe that once players have arrived, that they are already developed. But, the truth is that a soccer player never fully develops until the age of 28. How? Because the age of 28 is when the brain fully develops. I just don't think that Klinsmann knows how bad College Soccer is and if he does he can't do ANYTHING about it because that would be considered out of his jurisdiction. Caleb Porter isn't good for the International job because although Akron won the NCAA Championship one year, the rest of the Universities in the NCAA Division 1 Colleges aren't helping to make soccer better.
What I saw?
1. Terrible goalkeeping.
2. Terrible defending on set plays
3. Terrible defending in play
3. Poor passing.
4. Good to excellent attack.
A good passing team with speed is hard to beat. Barcelona is a good example. We still favor British style soccer in America. El Salvador just proved that a smaller, faster, and more skillful playing team will win. The USA defensive style is true to the USSF coaching manual but not as effective against a good passing team. The competition is getting better and the US A is not getting better.
Gordon, I am tired of that bad excuse of the best athletes in Usa dont pick soccer first. The best athletrs in soccer usually come from Africa. The best soccer players come from Hispanic countries usually. The best soccer players prevail over the best athletes. Barkley? Do you think he would be effective at blpcking lower 90s? Come on man!! The best soccer players in usa are going to Hispanic countries to get the opportunity they are not getting here. Plain and simple. I gaurantee you that if we found a way to keep all those Hispanics that left to other countries we would not be in this situation. Gordpn if you were picking the best athletes according to yiur standards you would never even consider a Messi, Xavi, Etc. You are the problem. People that think like you are the ones in charge of youth soccer. Hence, the consequences.
Hakim, right on. The question who is going to fill the seats in places like Nashville or anywhere for that matter?? Hispanics are a sure bet. Proven. They will win , create the much needed interest, make the money for soccer, make other nationality players want to play. Just lopk at basketball. Everybody wants to play Mike. With soccer it,s Messi or Cristiano. Lets get the best tecnical players out there. P.S. Blanco filled more seats than Beckham. Why do you think??
Justin, college soccer i s a clear reflection of youth soccer in general. They come out mostly to college ahowcases, another money maker and only players that can afford it get seen. Most pros get offers at 16-18 years old. College is plan B for the serious player.
Walt - I agree with your suggestions for the Academy, and believe MLS and US Soccer are moving in that direction. I think MLS needed to include distinguished clubs like Baltimore Bays, Chicago Magic, etc in the academy system in order to get the academy ball rolling, but the writing is clearly on the wall for those clubs. MLS academy teams will eventually rule the roost. With respect to whether we can completely fund these endeavors, wouldn't it be nice if MLS released its financials and we could see just how much money is spent on marketing? We as fans could do a great deal to increase the speed at which youth development is occurring in this country by demanding transparency from USSF and MLS and by holding execs accountable for endeavors. Structural changes are the solution to our development problems.
Luis - I really don't know whether our youth are superior or inferior to El Salvador. But I am a believer in the academy model, with MLS teams having a critical role in developing youth players, for future youth development in the US. As you well know, the system right now isn't sufficiently structured to ensure youth development. It places too much emphasis on winning. It does not entrust youth development a a permanent goal for coaches and organizations. And most importantly, it still charges players to play. But with a couple significant structural reforms to the academy and to MLS league structure, we can reform the system in the right way. Single-entity is the most important reason our soccer looks the way it does. Sometimes it drives me insane, and other times I respect it's complexity. At some point we need to have a conversation about when it makes sense to let teams swim for themselves. And that is a conversation Gulati and Garber wrongly feel they and they alone are entitled to have when they are ready. Every single soccer fan in the united states should have a say in how we can break pay-to-play and what we need to do.
Good afternoon everyone, I can see by reading the comments there are some valid points here. However as fans and followers of US soccer, we are quick to blame other reasons for failure. The hard truth of the matter is that failure came on all aspects. From the team players, coaches selections, player availability from abroad, the tournament organizers and USSF.
To Gak and Luis, there were many signs during and after the Canada game that the team was very suspect in team defending and goalkeeping. Looking at the team from a physical standpoint I would say he coaching and technical staff of the team was counting on that with the players. However did they considered the stamina of using the same players with 24 hours of rest in between the games. What were the tournament organizers thinking? The US staff should have realized that Canada was on par with the US physically, and El Salvador was better tactically and in technique superior to Cuba.
You all cite lack of skill/bad athletes whatevet. I call BS We have the deepest u23 pool ever. The main problem is our better U23 defenders were hurt or not called and, more importantly, the coach was exposed.
The midfield required a complete rotation given the ridiculously compressed schedule. Did Porter learn non-rotation from Bob Bradley?
Shae and Mix were done by halftime, yet they were left in Zombie like--totally gassed and ineffectual. Just like Junior Bradley was at the Gold Cup. That performance did not mean Junior Bradley is no good.
The subs came in way too late every game. Did Porter learn non-substitution from Bob Bradley?
How on earth did Hamid get the final start? A good coach makes people accountable. Hamid's Canada howler required a sit. If Johnson starts against ES the team is not in a position for Johnson's one and only gaffe--which was fatal.
The coach should have made tactical adjustments the last two games when is was clear a different deployment was necessary when momentum shifted.
So I totally do not see this as a talent issue. We are producing people good enough for concacaf while the academy system grows up. The problem is our youth coaching has not caught up yet.
Who learned the most from last night? I think it was Klinsmann. He was blined by how Porter can assemble a semi-possession team and motivate it. But that's the only place Porter succeeded. He showed great weaknesses in other parts of his game.
The excuse of academies failing in our country is absurd. For a very long time youth soccer teams in this country along with local camps and academies in cities here, have provided some great and good American born soccer players. granted that here in the US, soccer is not the major sport like baseball, basketball, and football.
David to support your comment that is my next comment the lacking of skilled players
The coaching and technical staff of US Soccer should have realized the lack of skilled positional players. Looking back at the 2011 U17 and U20 teams the lacking of skills on those teams should have raised a BIG RED FLAG. MLS,NASL, USL,PDL, College,youth clubs, etc.. is all that we have in this country to find or produce skilled players.
Gak, the academy system does not work. In Holland, we were sold on the Ajax system. Why did it work then? In the 80s a generation of players came thru who were given an opportunity to play in the 1st team and their "brotherhood" and talent helped them become world beaters as they mixed with top players. Same with Man United in the 90s, France in the 90s, and Barcelona today. But since 95, what has come thru Ajax's academy, or Man U's academy or what will come from Barca's in 5 years time? It is not the academy system that works, rather it is the generation of players that grow up together that make a team great.In the US, "academies" are elitist programs made by egotistical coaches who worried they would lose their best players to others. They will never work because you cannot have 80 clubs represent 50 states in America. You cannot trust the development of 20 million youth on a few hundred coaches and administrators. What US Soccer should be investing in is scouting. They need to pay scouts to watch Hispanic leagues, inner city leagues, rural leagues, high schools, colleges, community colleges, ODP, travel youth leagues, and all. Each major city and every state should have hundreds of scouts. Every summer, a list of players should be selected from age 15+ and brought together to train for a month and play some international games. Every year for every age group and when these players are 18, sign them up to the pro teams so they can develop further. ODP is supposed to do this job, but the selectors are poor and biased. So national staff with proven eyes for talent need to do the selecting from the month of camp. When a scout provides a player who is nowhere near the quality expected, don't pay that scout anymore. Job done. Until we search in every neighborhood for technically gifted youth, America will never win a Men's World Cup and the Women will continue to embarrass themselves to the likes of Japan.
Hakim - I respect your opinion but disagree. Man United prospects from recent years include Rossi, Welbeck, and Cleverley. Barcelona already has Tello, both Alcantara's, Muniesa ready for 20 mil transfers, not including Oriol Romeo. I will agree that the academy is not perfect and systems like Ajax and Man United face stagnation and a whole second set of problems in maintaining the system. But those issues lie with the application and direction of the methodology, not with the system itself. The academy model works, even for a country as big as the United States. Each MLS team will eventually have its own, fully-funded academy. The academy will have a radius of scouts that allow it to pick up urban and rural players. And the players that come out of those academies will be completely dependent upon the skills of the coaches and the environment they create. Scouting is a complete waste of time because our players aren't good enough. The system you describe, with hundreds of scouts roaming the country looking for players, sounds an awful lot like what we have now with ODP and college soccer. Read the story of Daniel Karbassiyoon. American player from Virginia who goes to a college showcase trying to get a scholarship, and leaves with an endorsement from Paul Mariner, former Revolution assistant and Arsenal player. A few phone calls later, Danny is on his way to Arsenal. Due to his commitment to training and his attitude, he made his debut with the GREAT Arsenal teams of the 1990s -Viera, Henry and all. IF you think Danny was innately skilled and we just missed it, then you probably think he is a poster child for scouting. But in my opinion, there are millions of Danny Karbassiyoon's in the United States. And hundreds of millions in Ghana, Brazil, Japan, etc. Environments produce soccer players. That's why Barca found Pique, Fabregas, and Messi in short order. Scouting cannot deliver that. Danny made it because he got plugged into the right environment, and he had the work ethic and belief to take care of the rest. The academy model is not perfect right now and needs lots of work. But what the academy wants to do is to create an environment, one by the way that Bradenton failed miserably to create, that will inspire magic. It is the best chance our players have of ever making money in this sport. I fundamentally believe environment's produce soccer players and that hundreds of players could be plugged into that environment and turn out to be 20 million dollar transfer targets. But that may be where you and I differ.
Gak, I meant youth playing system. El Salvador has none. That is the point. Their recruiting system is much better than ours obviously. Could it be they have more money to pay more or better scouts?? I dont think so. These scouts are attracting Usa born playerd to go to E l Salvador!! And beating us!! Hiw can we blame anything else if it is clear that there is no true desire to recruit the best. It is clear as day that selection is bias and that the Academies are being shoved down our faces as the "only" place to find or develop top talent without it having proved absolutely anything yet or been as of yet held accountable for not producing talent.
To the players they did what they could on the field, what the staff wanted them to do. they're only human. However being said lets not take anything away from Canada or El Salvador either. The big question in all this is the USSF. All of the heads of US soccer and Klinsmann were in Nashville last night. I would like to know as well as all who follows US soccer Why Nashville??. Home Depot Center was used for Mexico's group, a MLS stadium. What's wrong here is that Crew stadium, Pizza Hut Park, Toyota Park or any other stadiums with an MLS team could have been used.
MLS teams that have an academy is nowhere near a Ajax, Arsenal, Barcelona, or Manchester United. The fact to measure these academies to those prestigious clubs is absurd. the elite youth teams that compete like the Dallas Cup for instance, have a philoshpy on either team defense or offense very seldom do we see individual creativity. And coaches that see a player of that calibur on the opposing team will act quickly to nuetralize that threat on the field. Thus that mentality is created in those players at the cost of a teams ability to come out being more creative. On the field of play you want to instill confidence in those players that they can be just as skilled in their positions.
K Hakim and Gak Foodsource both points are very good and I agree and disagree with some. If both of you gentleman can give me what your take on the personnel in charge of the USSF. What do they know about soccer from a playing perspective? or is it more of a business
perspective?
Miguel - even worse - It's from a marketing perspective. Gulati teaches economics at Columbia and couldn't juggle a ball if his life depended on it. Garber was hired from NFL Europe to market MLS. The rest are all Rongen, Schmidt, and Arena desciples that may or may not know soccer, but have been so entrenched that creativity has long been beaten out of them.
On a closing note,I will say this the US soccer program will continue to grow,this will be a lesson learned. With all respect to the teams in the CONCACAF,any team on any given day can have their best or wrost. The USSF must take hard a look at itself as a whole if thing are to improve.
Thanks for the reply Gak best wishes to you my good sir.
This was a disaster from the start. Why Nashville? Why not hold it where we know the team will get fan support. The Cuba game showed nothing. Cuba was handicapped before the ejection. Then we lose to Canada where the team looked lost from the start. Then Canada ties Cuba? Good grief. You cannot convince me we are putting our best on the field. Now lets forget it and get going.
Luis, you clearly are biased in your opinion and have no clue. If YOU are a coach then YOU ARE THE PROBLEM. I have been there at the odp, high school, club and college level and been field level watching top international teams play. If you think Charles Barkley would not be a good goalkeeper then you are insane - literally insane - you probably think Campos was a good keeper due to your bias. And if you think I think Messi is not a good athlete then you are also delusional - I could have easily said until we get Chris Paul or Darrell Green or Drew Brees (all 6'0 or shorter) on the soccer field.
It is not all about the hispanic player. Get over yourself. You can talk all day about skill and coaching and Academies but until we get the best athletes to compete against other nation's best it will not happen for the US.
Lets nor forget it. If they held the game anywhere else you would have the same ratio. They simply figured Nashville was the whitest place to play for fan support and it still evened out!! Chicago would have seen more blue than red. Soccer is a Hispanic #1 sport. I bet if you had more hispanic americans on usa teams you would see much more support for usa in any city.
Gorfon, was El Salvador team a more athletic team than usa?? Why exactly would Barkley be such a great goalie?? You think someone in usa would take in a 4ft. 13 year old with a growth defect, invest $1000 a week in his treatment while not knowing for sure he will become a future soccer star??? I dont think so. That is exactly what Barcelona did for Messi. Never going to happen here. Odp id pay to play. H.S. is badly coached, college soccer is a joke. Daniel paid to go to that college showcase.
Luis, I did not see the game but I have seen enough to have formed my opinion at all levels - for example watching Blas Perez destroy our defenders recently - he is the best athlete in his country going against Cherundulo -NO CONTEST. Outside of CONCACAF, the separation is greater. Barkley would be a great goalkeeper for his great athleticism - his great hands (was one of the best rebounders ever), his great reach, his mentality -come on, surely you can admit this point. If it helps satisfy you, I am sure JJ Berea would have made an exceptional att mid.
I can only imagine Jurgen Klinnsman, surely after seeing our Olympic team, will say Adios after Brasil in 14.... We have no quality defenders commmin up amongst our Youth ranks... I can't believe after some 16yrs in our pro league, We only have to offer up a backline of Defense that is a complete lack of Talent... Gooch and Bocanegra, and Cherundolo may have to play until they have Grey beards, SMH
Some of the philosophy on academies and economics may hold truth. But this was a match with plenty to observe on the pitch itself. What did we see?
- Horrible goalkeeping. Maybe a fluke: just a payback for the generations of good keepers the US has had?
- Pretty darn good attacking from Shea, Boyd and Adu. Good quality
- ridiculous defending, terrible quality. 3 goals conceded, even with a 60/40 or more possession edge. Slow, poor fitness and instincts, nervy.
- I have no quarrel at all with Porter. His team played a good style.
Yes, it's an embarrassment. Yes, our system has flaws. But sometimes you just get beat. It's not always the system, the tactics and the nation.
I worry about the young defending players. But I see good things from promising players in attack. Not jumping off a bridge here.
Porter appears to be a pretty good coach but his intensity does not translate to his players. This team and his Akron team are loaded with talent and should not have much difficulty winning on a regular basis. But, gentlemen, it takes skill, teamwork, hard work on the field and huge commitment & sacrifice. I don't see all of those traits. Now the question is, Do our players not possess these qualities OR is it a reflection of the coach?
Horrible keeper play and sub-par defense.
We are always searching for backs that can attack down the wings because we always play four backs. Play 3-5-2 and find defenders who only have to defend. I know that there are plenty of better keepers, that was a farce.
Blas Perez vs Cherundolo? Rebounds are grabbed above the waist. It takes more than athleticism, height, reach and rebounding skills to be a great goalie. Much more. Campos was regarded one of the best goalies in the world in his time. El Salvador has no organized youth soccer system and very little money for development. The Usa team was clearly more Athletic, stronger and faster. El Salvador was simply more tecnical and hungrier. your counter is that more Athletic players would get the job done?
Gordon what best athletes do you speak of? Black people are the best athletes regarding basketball and football which they are always going to pick first. Top Hispanic athletes will always pick soccer first. Thats is why many will cpntinue to play for their old countries until Usa wakes up and shows more effort in recruiting them and that will be when it is painfully all too obvious that this system is bias and inadequate.
More "best athletes" arguments? Really? What no one has specifically mentioned here is the mental aspect of the game, which Ajax and Barca completely understand but no one in the US does. eg Charles Barkley, or Dennis Rodman, or any other awesome NBA player. Do they have the mental fortitude it takes to be a great keeper? To get beat 1-5 times per game and keep going back for more? NO. It takes a special person to compete at that level. The drivers of US Soccer seem to have no idea how to value chemistry, mental fortitude, the intangibles that separate a physical specimen from a world class competitor. To make matters worse, their physical specimens excel at speed and stature rather than quickness and cleverness.
Wow! This is great! It took me almost 30 minutes to wade thru all these comments. The intensity and diversity of opinion is good. Gaffes like this for the US happen in every country at all different levels. All is not lost nor has it been. You play and you learn. El Salvador was not wout it's mistakes either. The desire to be the best is there. At some point we will be and let's hope we enjoy it when we do cause that won't last forever too.
Luis, not sure why you have a question mark after Cherundulo and Blas Perez - Panama vs US, Gold Cup - trying to give you an example of someone from a smaller country that is still a much better athlete than the US players - for example Cherundulo - if you think Cherundulo is a better athlete than Perez that is a problem for you. Again - I did not see the El Salvador game so can't comment on that but my guess is, yes, they had better athletes. Further, if you think Campos, who failed to make it in the MLS, was one of the best keepers in the world then your bias has clouded your judgement beyond reason. And if you insist Charles Barkley would not make a good keeper then you know nothing about the game and R2 Dad - Barkley's mentality would be perfect for a keeper -tough, hard-nosed, vocal.
Gak, let's examine this further. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. If a man sees a painting, he may offer $1 million to the artist because he appreciates the craft, whereas another man wouldn't offer $5. This is the issue with the academy system and American soccer. Every coach thinks he is doing a great job with his players. The proof is in the pudding. Watch his team play, are they creative, skilled and comfortable with the ball? This is the frame of reference. I grew up watching Liverpool FC dominate English and European football for 20 years. It was the best style you could watch. So many world class players. So my frame of reference as a fan was the highest level you can have. I played in Europe and learned how to coach in different countries. In America I saw how overrated coaching was and how giving players empowerment to try things in games was the more important. You cannot create a Messi from drills. You have to nurture skills thru individuality. Thus I enjoy watching the teams of Redknapp, Wenger, Hiddink, Rijkaard and Guardiola, because not only do they play quality soccer, they improve their players. How many youth players have Bruce Arena, Claudio Reyna and co, developed? For me, if you have not coached players from age 6 to 26 in large numbers, you are not a development coach. So many coaches know tactically how to win a game, but no idea how to nurture skilled players. How can the academy system work when a roster of 22, only 14 may play and the others sit the bench game in game out? I have seen some of the best academies. But none could show that they consistently develop top players every year. The only country that consistently produces world class talent is Brazil. America is number one in all sports except soccer. Because we have had people without a vision of great soccer. They just wanted to win. Even Klinnsmann has brought nothing new to the table. He delights in beating a weakened Italian side, but forgets the US were dreadful for most of the match and will gain no confidence from a hit and run victory. If the US attacked Italy from the start and won the game, then the Americans could claim a great performance and use it as a yardstick for bigger things. But we all know when the US play Italy again, the Americans will defend for 80 minutes and hope to score on the break. There's no need to hire Klinnsmann for that. But that is the problem with the game here. Nobody at the top with an eye for talent and how to play the game with style. Maybe its because Americans come from high school and college soccer and don't know any better. Today's kids have watched Messi, Ronaldo, Ronaldinho, Rooney, Nani, Ibrahimovic, Seedorf, Robinho, Neymar, Hernandez, Xavi, etc LIVE. So they have a frame of reference that is greater than their youth play. They have You Tube and Iphones. So from this generation we may spawn a world class player. But it won't have anything to do with the academies.
Hakim, your right on. I am going to take it a little further. The only reason Usa is better at basketball and football is because they were forced to let black people play along with baseball. Lets not kid ourselves. There is an antiHispanic politically driven sentiment going on at the moment and it reflects on our national teams. I see it every time a Hispanic team plays a white team. The ignorance of racism is still very much alive. How come youth competitions at every level including Academy is usually dominated by Hispanic players but yet it dpesnt reflect in the same numbers at the national level? Think about it. We have Brazil, Argentina and Mexico in our same continent at a closer distance and we are trying to mirror the declining English style of play and gping to Germany to look for players?? Mexico has of late won the U17 World Cup, 3rd in the U20 W.C., Gold Cup won and is killing everyone in Olympic qualifying. They are our next door neigbors yet we are ignoring them and our own Mexican American players that end up over there. This isnt just strange, its alarming.
Gordon, you did not see the game. Take my word for it along with everyone else who saw it. The Usa was bigger, stronger and faster and tried using these tributes, like always, to their advantage. It didnt work because the Salvadprians were more tecnical and hungrier. Tgis country is smaller than New York City!! There is no gpod enough excuse for this loss to a country that has no prganized youth soccer program. Whats the limit on the best athletes in the usa that they couldnt match the best athletes of this tiny country??? Come on, man!! Spain, Germany and Argentina are also producing top basketball talent and catching up to usa in team play. Usa is declining in soccer team play. It is clear there is no true effort to pick the truly best players in Usa at any level for our state, regional or national teams. Before this happens how can we say we dont have the best athletes interested in Soccer??
When I was a kid the USA sent the dream team to the Olympics. After watching them play I talked my father into helping me put up a basketball goal on a telephone pole over our redclay driveway. I spent many hours winning the Olympics final in last few seconds with that incredible reverse left handed layup that I copied from the older players. I would play at the playground as that there were always games. As I got older and better I started to play with African American kids down in their part of town. It was the only way to get better and I was obsessed. Wherever I went with my friends we had a ball and we played. With no one to dictate our every move we came up with our own style of play. Individual style is very important on the playground. You can’t just beat somebody and go for the easy lay up you have to make it look good even if it is riskier. By the time these kids made it to high school their skills were 90% in place. All a coach had to do was try to organize and refine that talent. We went to the high school games with the rest of town especially if they made it to the state playoffs which was often. I can not begin to describe the excitement of the whole community both white and black going nuts over these kids. This was what sport was all about at that age. The best kids never went to an academy or were trained in any way except by perhaps older kids or Uncles or fathers. Mainly they just played for hours everyday after school and as much as possible on the weekends. Although we all dreamed of playing college or pro mostly we played for the love of the game.
However unless there is a large hispanic population nearby soccer is not experience like this in this country. I have a son that is just as obsessed with soccer as I was with basketball. He has had a ball on his foot pretty much everyday of his life pretending to win world cups in our living room or driveway since he was 6. He follows Barcelona and can tell you all about the top players in Europe and what the standings are in La Liga and the EPL. He copies their moves from you tube and uses them in games but now that he is 11 he wants to play with friends. But that is where the similarities stop. If he is looking for a pick up game at the playground nothing. While his friends all play soccer few of them play everyday or follow a professional or college team. The local high school games are supported mostly by parents rather than the whole community like football games are and are not near as exciting. We are not yet a soccer culture.
Yes we have some soccer clubs in our rural area but I am dubious of their value for training. These coaches are looking for big and athletic. I have seen their players and they are not that skilled and the main thing that they boast upon is how many state cups their U-10 through U14 teams have won. If I am going to pay for training I want to know how many players you have developed to highest level not how many games your U10 team won. I am looking for skills trainers not coaches who can only pick for size and speed. Even I can do that. Unfortunatlly, the clubs and academies bottom line depends on number of paying players, and except for marketing purposes, their is no money on the quality of the finished product. Parents who don’t know any better will pick the club that wins the most. Since we are not an educated soccer culture I don’t expect that to change anytime soon. I agree with Luis that there probably should be more Hispanics on USMNT. Blacks playing with whites in basketball and football helped ease the racial tensions of the integration of our schools in south in the seventies and eighties and certainly brought skill and creative level of the games up. I wish that USSF would support futsal more. That has been very good for our kids around here to play during the winter. Outdoor courts would be good for the summer. A futsal court lends itself more to pick games than a large soccer field as that you do not need 22 players to fill the court up and the game really emphasizes skill and quickness over speed and size. Because there is no money in it I don’t expect things to change anytime soon. This is just a parents perspective. I am sorta on the bottom rung looking up and it is not very encouraging at the moment.
Luis, because it is true - we don't get the best athletes playing soccer. Try getting down to field level for a US game and you will see the difference. Why are we successful in women's soccer? We have the same problems - same coaching, same ODP system, (same racial bias towards not picking hispanic players according to you)? Because we are getting the best female athletes.
Luis, I am not sure there is an anti-Hispanic feeling in soccer here but rather a mistrust due to language and communication. For example, with Black Americans even though they speak English, they have been discriminated against in soccer for decades. Still are. So there is no preference to Blacks over Hispanics. Blacks have only recently been courted into US National Team structure since the 90s. Hispanics are missing from the scene due to many factors such as: Hispanics not learning English, not paying to play in the travel youth system, Hispanic girls not being encouraged to play from an early age, Anglo Americans not living by Hispanics and thus not going to school with them and not understanding their culture, so they are ignored. Of course, I could list more, but these are very general and do not reflect every city in America. But I am in agreement with you that we need more Hispanic players involved in every level of the game, including coaching and administration. America is the perfect melting pot for all cultures. What we need are American National Teams to reflect the balance of those multi-cultures. That takes an eye for talent and a vision of how to play the game well. Currently, there are too few coaches with that eye on the national stage. Wes, you hit the nail on the head about futsal. This is the perfect training environment to nurture footskills for the outdoor game. You can build futsal courts easily in any urban setting and kids could play for free. Then we would see world class skills emerge and a nation ready to take on the world.
Gordon, your arguments get weaker and weaker. The only reason usa has dominated womens soccer is because they were pretty much the only country with women playing the sport and this is because other countries are not as open to womens soccer as usa has been. But if you notice that is changing and of course other countries like Japan are quickly catching up and passing usa womens soccer for the same exact reasons. Funny enough, there were 7 Usa born players on the Mexico womens team that played Japan very tight in the World Cup.
Hakim, believe me the eyes up top know exactly where the true talent is. They just dont want to pursue it. They are making themselves look bad in the process and will leave behind their very own legacy. There is an antiHispanic sentiment and it is easily and without a doubt reflected in usa soccer. But the obvious will prevail just like it did with black people and basketball. Once they leave their pride to the side and see how much money can be made by putting the right players on the field they will be successful on every level but still say it was because soccer grew in America. I agree with yiu on how black people have been kept out of soccer but we must agree that black people are accepted more as true Americans than Hispanics. There is another degree of caution when talking about black people in America. Hispanics are all seen as ilegal immigrants until we speak english with a good enough accent. It reflects in soccer the same way. Just go to a few all white vs all Hispanic games and tell me racism is even close to gone.
Wesley, you are too logical in your evaluation of usa soccer. Sadly there is too many who ignore the obvious and sign up with the top winning club. Why dont clubs get ranked only on players they developgoing by ratio? Its easier to recruit and win than develop. Its also more effective in making the quick buck. I started a small club with 10 players of which 8 were recruited by a top "Academy" club with promises of better oppprtunity and better development. It makes ne cry at night to see my 3 years invested in those kids ruined in less than 2. These were all my better players but the 2 that stayed with me are the only ones being considered for national team status. I hope this helps you but whatever you do dont settle for the usual.
Time will tell Luis on the women's game although people like you have been saying that for years and years - several cycles of players in many countries have come and gone. But it still is clear the US does not get the best athletes on the men's side and that is why they will never be a world force. US Soccer chose to put their Nike money and development into club when they should have done so in the high schools - where we lose the best athletes and it is not all about the Charles Barkley's - it is also about the 5'7 or 5'9 guy that is a super athlete but chooses football or basketball. The question is if Messi grew up in America would he have played soccer? My guess is he probably would have played point guard on the basketball team because some basketball coach would have pushed him that way whereas US Soccer does nothing about the quality of coaching soccer in the high schools.
Gordon, the usa would have done notging with Messi because he had a growth defect that required a costly treatment. There is no money in helping a young talent like this in Usa. That is the problem. Can you name 10 top Mexican American Athletes that dont play soccer?
Luis, trust me if a basketball or football coach saw his athleticism they would do whatever to get him playing - trust me. Your other points really don't address the issue.
Gordon, you cant name them because we are not using the top Mexican American Athletes. They choose soccer first yet we do not choose them first. Thats my ppint. Who here would invest $1000 a week for a year in a 13 year old with the only hope of him becoming an average pro and not knowing for sure he would be the best?? You sound extremely naive.
Luis, the top Mexican American athletes assuredly play soccer but hard to speak to that really. But that does not deflect the fact that the US men's program does not get the best athletes - are you saying the Mexican American athletes are the best athletes in the US? Who is naive?
Luis, and to be clear I don't care if the athlete is black or white or Hispanic - I just want them to be the best athlete and for them to pick soccer. That probably distinguishes us a bit.
Gordon, Wow You are really slow. Mexican Americans are the best Soccer Athletes in USA. That's what I said. Why do you continue to waste your time hoping for African Americans to all of a sudden go for Soccer instead of Baketball and Football. Waiting for that is like waiting for Europeans to choose another sport before soccer. It won't happen!! By best Athletes you surely mean Black People in Usa, don't you?? Because they certainly are in Basketball and Football which are the 2 sports you mentioned.
White people are the best athletes for golf. It would be dumb to say Black people are the best golfers only because of Tiger Woods. I am talking in general. In General, Black People are better Basketball Players, White people are Better Golfers and Hispanics are better Soccer Players in USA and all of the American Continent. In every USA sport this is reflected except in Soccer. Simple. Comprende??
Luis, being slow is defined by not understanding something that is written repeatedly. You are a biased person that is blinded by your prejudice. You think the solution to the problem is to pick Mexican Americans. I think the solution is to pick the best athletes period regardless of skin color or race. So now, to slow this down for you and for the 10th time, I don't mean black people - I mean anyone - the best athletes.
Gordon, my politically correct friend, what % of black players would you say usually make the national basketball teams? I am basing all of my comments on facts and logic. You are running for President. When in fact we do get a majority of Hispanics on the usa natipnal teams we will then be a top soccer country. It is inevitable. Has npthing to do with being bias. Hispanics love soccer, this is why in general they are better at it as athletes.
Luis. I was curious so looked up the 2011 U17 WC team and found - Mexican American players E. Rodriguez and M. Rodriguez and Guido, Columbian American Melo, Scottish American McBean, Venezualan American Mion, Bosnian American Salkicic, not sure - Serna and Pina, Japanese Americans - Acosta and Fehr, Koroma was born in Sierra Leone, Pelosi was born in Germany and they were coached by Wilmer Cabrera (Columbian). That leaves 8 of the 21 players who seemingly were born in the US and whose parents were born in the US. 6 of the 11 starters in the final game vs Germany were either born elsewhere or who's parents were. I don't know the actual definition of Mexican American or hispanic or what we call someone who's parents and themselves were born in the US (American Americans?) but seems like we already have tried your way and this team won one game and was crushed by Germany 4-0 in their last game (and it could have been worse if you saw the game - it was men against boys). In effect, YOU ARE WRONG. Nothing will change unless the best athletes are picked - hispanics, black, white - does not matter - not just the better soccer athletes but the best athletes, period. This should really end the discussion.
Gordan, your last point is completely correct...I have been reading articles and comments on this website and Luis is ALWAYS making it about how the MAN is holding back "Hispanics" but mainly talking about Mexican-Americans. He always points out that Mexico are taking players from the US for their national senior and youth teams but ignores the fact that the USSF does extremely well in keeping the dual-nationals. I'm pretty sure that he wants to see the US senior side to have 11 Mexican-Americans.....even though if you look at the senior side there is only one player that I would take over our starters and that's Chicharito.
Gordon, the U17 would had played much better if it had more 9 Hispanics as starters at the least. You cant acknowledge the fact that a Usa basketball team will always have 90% black players even though its obvious. We are getting to the ppint that the Mls is being dominated by Hispanics as the better players with most up and coming top players almost always being Hispanic but it still does not reflect on our natipnal team. This is hard for people like to acknowledge even they are facts and not just opinions because you are blinded by your own bias opinion. If you reseaech some more of the U17s you will find that the goalie on the W,C. U17 Champs Mexico team is born in Usa.
Jared, I will see 80_90% Hispanics on the Usa national team some day. At the end of the day its about results and how to get them. You would only take Chicharito? That shows just how little you know of soccer my friend. There are at least 5 other Mexican players that are better than him and the entire team is much better than Usa. If you took the entire Mexican team and turned into the usa team you would instantly have the best fan support in the usa. People like you and Gordon here probably have the same opinion on which players are better for usa and this is why we are losing. Usa players better than Mexicos? Ok. The results sure say so, huh.
P.S. by people like you I meant the ones picking the talent in Usa.
Luis, wow. Since 2000 the US MNT record vs Mexico is 10 wins, 5 losses, and 2 ties. When it mattered most in the WC, the US won 2-0. I have no idea what your point is about the majority of basketball players being black is so there is no reason to acknowledge it - NBA teams are majority black I assume - does that help? Jared, thanks for clearing things up about Luis. It seems Luis is now saying hispanics are better than Americans, Europeans, Asians, and Africans and he is spouting off about my bias. Wow.
Luis, I'll get to you in a second. Gordon, yeah Luis is always trying to call people out about bias but it's clear who the bias person is...just oblivious to his own. Even when the US has clearly been the better team in the best decade, they still believe Mexico is better...It's pretty clear that he is a Mexico fan not a US fan. Also when you debate with him, he will spout off random stuff to make it look convincing but if you actually double check him then he ignores it and goes on to make another invalid argument. Luis, it's not about the results and how to get them, because when the US does well and wins, you complain about not having enough Hispanics on the team and when the US loses, you say its about not having the Hispanics on the team....it's a lose lose with you till the US becomes Mexico. How little I know??? That's laughable coming from you...Who are the "at least 5 Mexican players" you speak of, names and clubs please.... If you actually do some research Luis, then you would know that the US does extremely in getting the dual nationals to play for the Nats, you name one keeper for the U-17s, but neglect that we have two keepers on the U-17s that are Mexican-Americans already. Plus what is the US worried about keepers, thats one position in the past 20 years that the US has produced much better quality than Mexico.
Yea, strong showing by goalies at this one. Gipvanni Dos Santos and his brother both played for Barcelona as Starters. Barrer and Guardado both in Spain along with Juarez. Ochoa is in France. There are constant offers for many more from Eurpoe like Di Nigris, Fabian, etc. Who their clubs will not release. Mpreno plays in Europe. No comparison with Usa. Friendlies dont count. In the kast year Mexico has shown to be a top 10 soccer country and Usa has shown to be a 30-40 mknus rank. I wish Usa did better and am frsutrated they dont pick the best americans wich are Hispanics. You guys think that lying to yourselves is showing patriotism. You are the ugly side of America.
Gordon, my point about usa basketball is that it is easy to state that black people have for a long time now completely dpminated it and will continue to do so for years to come. That is not bias. It is a fact. Id I were black would that nake ne bias? The same is with soccer and Hispanics. Basketball is the first sport of choice for the top black athletes. Soccer is tops for Hispanic top athletes. Understand now??
Luis, I'm not saying you are bias because you continue to tell me black people play basketball. I am telling you that you have bias towards hispanics being the solution to the US MNT troubles. It does not matter if the top black athletes pick basketball and the top hispanic athletes pick soccer- I want the best athletes to play soccer regardless of race. Understand? It is not that difficult.
One tournament doesn't mean they are trash keepers..funny thing is you ignore the fact that we have had better keepers. Giovanni Dos Santos was bought by Barca early and couldn't cut it, then sold to Tottenham and couldn't cut it, then loaned out three years in a row to Ispwich Town, Galatasaray, and Racing Santander and still only played in half the games. Now he is back at Tottenham and has only played in five games out of roughly 30. His brother has only played in a few games. Barrera bought by West Ham and couldn't cut it then loaned out to Real Zaragoza and has only played in 18 of 29 games. Guardado is playing in second division Deportivo and has progressively gotten in less and less games over the past 4 seasons, now at 19 out of 30. Juarez is at Real Zaragoza and not getting much time with 15 out of 30 games. Ochoa is finally the number 1 at Ajaccio in Ligue 1. We have quite a few in Europe also, Dempsey, Howard, Bradley, F.Johnson, D. Williams, Bocanegra, Edu, Cherundolo, Diskerud, Gatt, Holden, Jones, Kljestan, Friedal, Whitbread, Spector, Ream, Gooch, Lichaj, Altidore, and we have ones that are getting offers or close to first team action in Europe like Shea, Gyau, Boyd, Cunningham, Doyle, Wooten, Wood, Morales, Jeffery, etc....and then not to mention Donovan who for some reason refuses to stay in Europe even though he starts and does extremely well when he is there. No comparison.....I think we do pretty well. Oh yeah, I forgot friendlies only count when Mexico wins...Mexico is not a top 10 team not even top 15...keep living in that dream world of yours...at least I can admit that the US should be at the end of the top 25-30 till they play consistently. We have Hispanics and they aren't the top players on the team...Howard, Demps, Holden, Donovan, Chandler, Dolo, Johnson, Bradley are our best players. Actually as far as being the ugly side..that is definitely you...looks like me and Gordon have said that we don't care the racial background as long as the best players are playing and the US in winning...it can be 90% black, 90% white, 90% asians,90% Hispanics, I could care less.....but it looks like you want 90% Hispanics because of racial bias.
The Mexican players in Euorope play on much better teams than Usa players and get paid more because of the quality. I am all for the best picked regardless of race. It just so happens that in tgis case you would see many more Hispanics called up if there were a true effort to pick the best in usa. There isnt. Pay to play doesnt work. Usa did not qualify for U20 W.C. eliminated by Guatemala. Killed at W.C, U17. Killed at Gold Cup. Now this. Mexico the opppsjte. We should learn from this country soccer wise and stop trying to come up with dumb excuses. Gordon, you said the best athletes come out of the pporest neigborhoods in Usa. Did you mean poor white hoods? Its obvious you meant the ghetto. There arent any football or basketball players coming out oc the barrio. Why? Soccer.
Luis or Al Sharpitano - stop trying to turn this in to a racial issue! Seriously. I said players in middle and upper classes tend to not be as hungry and as coachable as others. That does not mean there are not great athletes of all skin colors at every class -that really was a more societal issue (helicopter parents, etc.) - in my coaching experience there were terrific athletes an competitors from the upper class and some not so good ones in the lower class - I was just speaking in general. Dempsey is an example of someone that I understand was not raised in a middle or upper class environment. For the last time, I am not talking about black people when I say the best athletes - PLEASE STOP commenting on that. Let me try and be clear to you again - I DONT CARE THEIR RACE OR THEIR SOCIO-ECONOMIC BACKGROUND - I JUST WANT THE BEST ATHLETES TO PLAY SOCCER.
Gordon, so waht you are saying is that lower classes of a higher tendency of hunger and being coachable. I am saying tge obvious, theses lower classes tend to be black and Hispanic mostly. Thats a fact. It is ok to say what is true. Try it. Since Hispanics pcik soccer first ,it should reflect so. By the way, Mexi?o made Canada look really bad today.
Al, boring. I got it - no white people or nobody who was born in the US or who's parents both were. Got it.
Rush Limbaugh, it is what it is. Inevitsble. You will see and I will be there to say I told ypu sp.
Rush Limbaugh??!! Hilarious. Rush would not want black people involved and would want only white people involved - kind of like you and hispanics - he does not think black people can play quarterback and you don't think white people can play soccer with skill - you are kind of a combination of Sharpton and Limbaugh.
Never said that. You just want interpret that way because it is cpnvenient for you. White people can be tecnical and very good but I am talking about as a majority and as a culture, Hispanics are more tecnical and is part of their culture. Just like basketball and black people. There are certainly great white players in basketball but the najority of the best have, are and will be black. Soccer is not loved overall or lived the same way in the white community as it is in the Hispanic community. The best white players in Illinois seem to understand this as you will spot them playing on Hispanic league teams. They love it and improve. All I am saying is why not take that example to a higher level so everyone benefits fron it? EVERYONE.
So you want US Soccer to pick hispanics and play like Mexico?
Are there any bad qualities from the Mexican/hispanic player (in general)?
Of course there are but in soccer the great tecnical ability suprass them. I beleive todays Hispanic player in Usa is overcoming the strengt h factor and this is why they are attracting more and nore scouts from other countrys. Just like in basketball white people usually show better text book fundamentals but style, creativity and athleticism from black players make all the difference. If you just ha d plain good fundamental basketball without the creative moves, dunks nobody would watch. Everyone wants ti see Barcelona play. Nobody can stand watcging too much of the Italian defensive soccer or the mibdles kick in run Mls.
I want Usa to pick tge "best" american players. I just think that the majority are Hispanic. Its in our blood. If this happens I rhink we can be better than Mexico but surely better than El Salvador and Canada.
Well, honestly, there are some things I don't like about this and there are some things I don't like about the Mexican player (in general)- there does not seem to be as much of an emphasis on sporting behavior - Marquez's behavior in NY, Sanchez trying to trip Eddie Johnson after a goal, refusing to shake hands or exchange jerseys - I know this is not every Mexican player - I am a huge ManU fan and really like Hernandez who always plays with great class but I cannot think of one poor sporting incident ever by a US player in a Mexico vs US game - maybe you don't agree with that but what I am saying is (and we have strayed a bit but I still believe in my original concept that we don't get the best athletes and, no, I don't think if we do they will be mostly hispanic) why are we always trying to get the US to play like someone else - like Spain, like Mexico - why don't we embrace who we are, always seek to improve, but embrace who we are - this is not Mexico - I like our sporting behavior, I like our fight. England will always be England no matter how many times people tell them to play more like Spain - England is fast and direct -so what, be England and let us be Americans.
Gordon, I can respect your opinion. You see how easy that is? We can just agree to disagree. The prpblem I see is Usa trys too hard to play like England and England has done nothing internationally in a lpng time. Usa has not been Usa. Usa soccerwise is rich in Hispanic culture. We should embrace that fact. Truth is you just dont want to see more Hispanics on the team no matter what the facts say. Now we are talking abput class. Do black people always display the greatest class in the Nba or internationally?? You are a big fan of Barkley. He showed zero class in that Dream Team run throwing that African player an elbow to the chest. There are unclassy players everywhere. It is just easier and more accepted in Usa to critisize the Hispanic but not the black person at the moment. There is a history of hippcracy in this country and it lives on. Its just more pplitical now.
Here is what I dont like about spprts in general in Usa. White people were forced to let black players in and eventually dominate basketball and football but made it as hard as ppssible for that to happen. This shows how racist they have been and can be in general. Once they saw how much money black players attracted with their attractive style of play it was ok for them. Racism still is very much alive and there are more reasons to believe it exists in Usa soccer than it doe not. You for example are trying really hard to highlight why we should not have Mexican American players on the Usa team, class as a general issue. That is far from true. On the other hand I have personally heafd 12 year old kids call hispanics "beaners" among other racial slurs. Parents as well. All white. Is this class?? Barkley was not put on the Dream Team for his class. He was there to win. Hipocrit.
Luis, you have gone off the deep end. You obviously don't like black people or white people for that matter. I am not racist and try to be very fair - i like the Mexican culture from what I see from afar - close knit families, seemingly hard workers, never seeming to play 'the victim' (except for you). My Dad grew up in Brownsville,, TX and would spend time in Mexico and my uncle adopted a hispanic daughter - doesn't make me an expert or anything. I never said there was not unsporting people in all walks. You said we should have majority of hispanics on the MNT and I simply addressed that and pointed out a negative aspect of that I thought in a pretty fair and true way. If you are not self-aware and cannot see your flaws then that is your problem to deal with - I realize it was a general statement but surely deep down you can admit that it is factor of the Mexican player and I don't want that as part of my country's national team. I was addressing your point - you don't need to go out and point out flaws from every other race and sport - that is not the issue you brought up. And I specifically addressed the US and Mexican MNT- nobody else and I state again I am not aware of any unsporting behavior by the US MNT in a game against Mexico. Try and stick to the issue. And while I do have a problem with some traits of the Mexican player if that player is the best athlete then I want him on the US MNT regardless of race or ethnicity. One of my favorite players on the US MNT is Ricardo Clark (Dad from Trinidad) - I love his fight. You probably like him because he is hispanic even though he is black and is not that technical. I like Torres and Gomez and think they deserve more looks. I think Cherundulo won't cut it nor DeMerit nor Sasha. I hate Altidore. It is not about race. You talk about being politically correct and I cannot even make a general comment about the Mexican player without you accusing me of wanting no hispanics on the US MNT. I WANT THE BEST ATHLETES. The US style is still being found - it is not determined yet but it should be our style - the American style - not your style, not the Mexican style, the American style.
The Usa style will eventually be big strpng tecnical Hispanics as a majority with great tecnical skills. I know what you are saying . To understand and evaluate soccer in Usa we must go back to otger Usa spprts to see how they developed . You brought up Barkley and how great a goalie he would be for Usa, yet yku never mentioned anything about his class or lack of but when speaking about the Mexican player the lack of class in some of them is an issue you felt you had to adress. Thats called being a hipocrit. I dont hide what I feel or think. You do. I played basketball my whole life as a point gaurdin H.S. I chose to play always vs and witg mostky black people because they were the best. I could also appreciate the fundamental game wgiite people brought but learned much nore from black people. I wish I saw more Mexicans in the Nba but I understand why there arent too many. Its not a big part of our culture. I get it. Wgy cant you ??
When we were talking about Barkley I was just making my first statement about athletes - if Barkley or any others regardless of race were unsporting I would not want them - our conversation evolved so that does not make me a hipocrit. I have tried to be open and fair and given you examples of players I like and don't like of all races - that is called being unbiased. You have yet to really speak to any flaw in the Mexican player - that is called biased. You are blinded by your prejudice. You say you want to be honest and then you don't really address flaws with the Mexican player - you only address flaws with black basketball players or some white racist parents. Not very honest and open of you. I point out both sides - i.e. some things I like about the Mexican player (Hernandez) and things I don't like - I point out white players I don't like (not athletic enough) yet you don't do any of the same for the Mexican player. And you want honest and saying what you feel. I guess the Mexican player is perfect and all should be on the US MNT.
Gordon, ok tell us what you feel about the black athlete as far as class is concerned?? Lets see if you are not biased against Hispanics and critisize other races bad trends.
I don't need to get sucked into a discussion on race - that is your territory. I don't like people of any race that are unsporting - black or white or hispanic and we all have stereotypical flaws. But the issue is that you said the MNT should be majority Hispanic and that is what I am addressing. Address their flaws like I said? Or maybe they are perfect.
Gordon, you already highlighted exanples of Mexican players.
Do the same for black and white players.
Or is it ok for you to only state nwgatice teends you see in Mexicans?
You said you want majority Hispanics on us MNT - you did not say you wanted whites or blacks. I am addressing the issue - do the same or just admit you think they ate perfect and move on.
I did adress the issue. I stated who I thought was best at what. All 3 races. Now you do it with your critiques on class.
I answered that already. Every race has and will continue to have unclassy players. Its a standard flaw. Tecnique and skill is what seperates the best from others in all spprts. Why would soccer be any different? It is comparable to basketball. Same thing. Your
Turn
Could not do it - too bad - it is beneficial to see all sides of an opinion. Mexican/hispanic players are perfect.
Not perfect. Best soccer players yes. I see your onpy critique of demeanor was for Hispnics. Notanyone else. Good enough. No ore need to be said, brother.
I said everyone has faults but we are not talking about other races - we are talking about your biased opinion that the majority of the US MNT should be hispanic.
It's called race-baiting. You think everyone is out against hispanics. I tried to have a reasonable discussion with you about it but you could not do it and tried to twist it around. Pity Al.
See I told you Gordon, it's a lose lose with him...you can never change his opinion. When you clearly win one point, he jumps to the next and never cedes the first....so on and so on. He always tries to pin everyone as being a racist as it's pretty clear it is quite the opposite.
Yeah, agreed.
Which point did he win Jared?
Gordn, your only argument agains t Mexican American, even though I said Hispanic, players is class in some. But when asked about your opinion about other ehnicities you dont want to fall in race baiting? Haha. Players class had nothing to do in our discussion. You brought that up but did not follow up. We were talking about the most skilled and talented athletes. In my opinion its Hispanics in Usa. Its proven a all age levels. Go to the Dallas Cup going on right now and check for yourself the numbers.
Gordon , who baited you to critisize Mexican players class in general? You see what I mean. It is is easily accepted to critisize the Hispanic but when it comes to doing the same about black people, your scared. You can say this isnt Mexico when the notion of Usa soccer team having nostly Hispanics but will you say or have you said this is not Africa when seeing so many black people on Usa national teams? That makes you bias and a Hipocrit.
Look Luis - you are honestly blinded by a lot and quite obviously have something against black people - you say the US MNT should be majority Hispanic/Mexican. I address that and give some positives (pointing out Hernandez, Torres, Gomez) and point out I don't care what race they are and then point one negative aspect of YOUR POINT and you can't answer it nor deal with it and try and make it about race. Get over your bias or don't make comments. It was YOUR POINT - you did not say you wanted majority black people on the team. If you do make another comment just respond that you think your point is the perfect solution and you would appreciate nobody making a contrary point. As to the Dallas Cup - don't need to go - saw the 2011 U17 World Cup and how bad we got crushed.
Yea, Nexico won that one. I have something against black people? What did I say that even sounded likethat??
I made a point about skill. You countered with class. Who changed the subject? I countered your clss statement asking you to generalize other ethnicities. Now it is inconvenient for you and you want me to answer your question. Asnwer mine first then I wil adress yurs in that order. Better yet next time dont put your foot in your mouth if you are not an enogh to follow though.
YOU addressed my comment Luis and stated the majority of the US MNT should be Hispanic - I make points positive and one negative and you try and turn into a racial thing - I guess I should have just said that your idea is perfect - you are the child if you can't handle that and try and change the subject - be a man and address the good AND bad in your point - you can't do it because of your bias. Don't try and say it is about just skill - picking players is about skill and character and other factors - don't be naive and don't comment any more if you have no self-awareness - like I said just claim you and all Hispanics are perfect and be done with it.
And by the way Dallas Texans 0-0 with Mexican U20 national team - goalscorers in game earlier vs Frankfurt were Brandon Aubrey, Caleb Richardson and Geoffrey Hill - not sure their ethnicity but.....
Ok so I thonk think Hispanics are perfect and you think they dont deserve t be on the Usa team because they dnt have class.
Check out al tge younger teams like Magic 80%
Gordon, what is it calle then when you only make a negative comnent of one race but wont do the same for the other 2?
I can't tell what you are saying with your misspelling but the second part is not what I said and you know it - I said pick the best athletes regardless of race. My point about character was a simple, and I thought decently pointed out, possible negative aspect of YOUR point and you can't handle it - I made it clear I was not talking about every Mexican player and pointed out Hernandez. If the U20 Mexican national team can't beat a bunch of American Americans that kind of hurts your point as well, doesn't it? Oh sorry, you can't handle any self-awareness. Just be a victim and call everyone a racist. It is a very positive trait I admired in Hispanics that I never heard that sort of 'victim' talk before you.
It's called addressing the issue YOU brought up - for the 100th time - you said you want majority hispanics on the US MNT - you did not talk about other races so shut up about that.
You spoke of Hernandez as a special case. My point involved hispanic, black and white. Your negative critique involved only Hispanics character.
I stated skill for all 3. You dont want hispanics on usa team because of class in some but refuse to comment on character of other 2. What is that called?
I did talk about it. I said black people and white people dont live soccer with the same passion as hispanics in general and as a majority. This is easily seeen because they pick other spprts firt. Black people pick basketball and show great passion for it. Thats talking about veryone!! Dont put your foot in your mouth if your nit man enough to follow through.
I am far from being a victim. I simply state these things so everyone is aware of the truth about usmnt anvthe hipocracy in this country. You helped y case with your backtracking. I know how to work this system to my advantage and will do so. Hey, if Usa wont appreciate us then lets keep going to our nother countries. It will be funny to watch this jeep blowing up in teir face.
I really doubt that Mexico would bring their best U20s to Dallas. In the olympic championship Mexico was bold enough to play 4-5 bench players to give them the experience. One of them was the the 2011 U20 W.C. goalie that took 3rd place in the world.
Your point was the MNT of the US should be majority hispanic - don't backpedal and say you talked about blacks and whites in that same regard - you only brought it up when I made a fair negative comment of the Mexican player because you can't tolerate that and think it is racist (playing the victim) and tried to get me to comment on other races - you did not say the US MNT should be majority white or black - why comment on that? And to make excuses for the U20 team is more 'victim' mentality, more lack of self-awareness, more lack of humility. Maybe, in some way, you are proving my point. And stop saying I don't want Hispanics on the team - that is a flat out lie and more lack of character.
Can you imagine somebody saying thi isnt Africa when somebody else mentions he believes that the national basketball usa team should have more black players because they show to have more talent and skill?? I can. In the 50s. Not so easily accepted now is it?? For some reason people like you thik it is eay to speak of Mexicans this way now proving that racism is far from gone in tgis country. I am not a victim. I fight back politically and through awareness.
Now you are pissing me off - you are flat out lying and misrepresenting everything I have said - I never said not to have more hispanics on the team - I did say Gomez and Torres deserve more chances - are you serious with your race baiting or did you just forget I said that? I said we are Americans and should find our American style and find the best athletes REGARDLESS OF RACE- did you forget I have said that multiple times or are you just race-baiting?? So your feeble analogy is poor, racist, and a lie. Look in the mirror - you are the biggest victim out there. Quit your bitching and try and see all aspects of YOUR point - good and bad.
Gordon , this blog, cpmment April 2, 12:15am. This is not Mexico. Im lying now?? Who is backpedalin??
I baied you to say that?? Who are you trying to kid?? I m pissing you orf now. I really wis you and me were face to face when yu said that. If you are sorry you said that ten just say so. I dont think you are sorry as you think Hispanics dot have class. All races have classy people and all have eople without. Therefore no one is perfect. That was such a stupid question. There are however better athletes at certain sports in certain races due to important factors like culture, preference, ability, skill, etc.
"This is not Mexico" was a reference talking about style of play - I was not saying to have no hispanics on the US MNT - and you know that - that is 'baiting' and by trying to get me to comment on other races -'baiting' and lying. I too wish we were face to face. I'm only sorry I did not see the other poster's comments before trying to argue with you then I would have known what a waste of time it is. I also did not say Hispanics don't have class and you know that too - you are such a liar - I said in general some players have shown lack of sporting behavior and gave specific examples - I even said I know we are not talking about all Mexicans - you are such a race-baiting dishonest person. If I was to pay serious attention to YOUR point I looked at it from good and bad. But you can't handle it - throw out the U20 tying a club team and you play victim and make an excuse, point out the U17 US team losing with many hispanics and you play victim and make an excuse, point out some flaws in some Mexican players and you play victim and claim racism - see a pattern? A better analogy would be if I said the US MNT should be majority white and you commented on that they are not as skillful or that they are too upperclass and don't compete well and I would respond that you are a racist - that is exactly what happened. Keep the blinders on Al or maybe try and become someone who is honest and self-aware but really do stop lying.
How can"in general" go along with "some" Mexican players?? Youspecifically and only said Mexican players here in same coment. Now you are rying to say you meant everyone?? Come on dude.
Why would picking all or most Mexican American players mean being Mexico?? This akes no sense unless you dont onsider them to be American.
Why would you say what you dont like about mexican players in general for the behavior of some?? Thats stupid. Specially given the histoy of character in Baseball, Basketbal and Baseball. Thats reallydumb. Why would character have anything to do with how a player should be selected given any of these examles in Usa sports? When has being the ost talented not been enough in Usa sports "in general"?? You want me to answer a stupid questipn like "are they erfect"??
Mexican American players will play like Mexican "American" players. Why would it mean us playing like in Mexico?? Get it together man. You saying you like our sportsmanship now means what?? That once we get mostly Hispanic players that will stop?? Our sportsmanship will disappear??
Pointless nonsense - you obviously have trouble understanding simple english - you seem to not be able to understand words such as 'general' and 'some' nor the differentiation of style of play and player selection - I can't help you with that - maybe take it to someone smarter and see if they can help you. If you think sporting behavior has nothing to do with representing your country and player selection then you have nothing more to contribute.
It is stupid for you to bring up sportin behavior as a negative in Mexicans butnot do the sae for black and white people who also have plenty of examples of poor sportig behavior. You have no point.
Sporting behavior has its value, it is just stupid for you to signal out Mexicans in "some" cases showing bD sportig behavior that you dont want on our usmnt ignoring the fact that white and black people have also shown plenty of examples of poor sporting behavior. Pointless an stupid.
Mexican "American" play as American as anybody else. Stupid.
Your poins can only be 1 of 2 things or both, bias and stupid. "This is not Mexico" meaning "style of play" when the notion of having mostly Mexican Americans play is stating that they will not play an American style of play. That is stupid. It is like saying Africa Americans will play like i Africa if they are the majority of players on usmnt. Or like white people will change the style of play to European ahd not American. Stupid. Does our basketball usnmt play like in Africa style because they are always 90% African Anericans?? Do you not see how stupid your points are??
You are a moron with an indescribable victim mentality that has a tough time understanding basic concepts. You said US MNT should be majority hispanic - I tried to discuss THAT ISSUE - yet you repeatedly try to bring other races into it - that makes you a moron. I brought up the issue I have seen with the Mexican player about sporting behavior and you can't handle it or discuss it and just play the victim and use the race card - that makes you a moron. I even said I can't think of one sporting issue with the US MNT in the Mexico rivalry - that makes you a liar and a moron. Style of play has nothing to do with the make-up of the team necessarily - I already said that - you are even trying to turn that into a racial issue - that makes you a race-baiting, victim-playing imbecile. You want us to play like Spain and Brazil and Mexico -short passes, tiki taka, etc. Great, super but we are not Spain or Brazil (see I left off Mexico for you) - let's keep improving our skill and address our weaknesses but find the American style - do you get that? Find the best athletes REGARDLESS OF RACE and find the American style - quit trying to be someone else - understand? It has nothing to do with race - that makes you a race-baiting, play the victim moron who keeps bringing up the same thing.
More stupidity. I never said we should play like anybody else. What does me saying we should have more "Hispanic Americans" pn our usmnt have to do with the Mexico vs Usa games?? Why are you bringing up the "Mexican " player when the subject is Hispanic American players?? Are they all the same to you?? In your opinion would a Usa team of 90% Hispanics simbolize a true Aneican team with an American style of play??
So now you are saying you never said the US MNT should play different and now you are saying you have never even implied that the US MNT should play more like the hispanics - more deceit and dishonor. Mexicans are hispanic aren't they? More stupidity.
I did say we shiuld play different but did not say like another country. Mexicns in Usa are Hispanic. Thats very good. But not all Hispanics are Mexicans in Usa even hough it might seem that way to you. I said more Hispanics and not just Mexicans, Limbaugh. God Damn, yourdumb.
Again, in your opinio, would a usnmt of 90% Hispanic players be considered by you a "true American " soccer team with a truly "American" style of play???? Please answer senor.
Is this race baiting as well hipocrit?
More lies - this entire time you have been discussing hispanics but with a heavy implication of Mexicans - March 29 - "Wow You are really slow. Mexican Americans are the best Soccer Athletes in USA." Then on March 31 - "Mexico the opppsjte. We should learn from this country soccer wise and stop trying to come up with dumb excuses." You repeatedly referred to Mexico and the Mexican American player -you don't seem to care much about truth nor sporting behavior nor any character. And now you are saying you aren't implying the US to play like other countries when clearly you want us to play more like Mexico or Brazil or Spain. You are a dishonest person and a race-baiter and a person that plays the victim and repeatedly comes up with excuses.
Again, in your opinion would a Usa team of 90% Hispanics simbolize a true Ameican team ??
Now because I think highky of the skilled mexican american and the Mexico teams as of late , I dont care about sporting behavior or character??
Because I think we should learn from successful soccer countries that are closer to us like Mexico or Brasil means I think we should play like them??
Gordon people like you make my point about the hpocracy in this country. There's a long nonstoppibg history of hipocracy in this country and you are a great example. There is only one thing Ihate more than a racist. A dishonest racist like you. It was forcefully accepted that black people play sports in USA, be part of society, and then the dominant force behind its more popular sports. No surprise. We just have to look back and work the system the best we can.?
You are an idiot. I am not a racist nor a hypocrite. You are a race-baiter and the worst thing you could be for your race. You are dishonest and deceitful and cannot address YOUR point and issues with your point.
Good job Gordon, calling me names is easier than answering my direct questions because they are not easily answered with you political B.S. Anybody reading this can easily see how hjpocritical your comments are. Good job. You make my point.
So "dishonest racist" is okay? Guess that proves everything really. Let's try this - I think the US MNT should be majority white.
Gordon, there you go. Finally some honesty unpolitical truth from you. That's where you should have started. There is nothing more to be said unless you have a reason for arguing that possibility. If you do so please be bluntly honest like you just were. That I can respect.
Because they are better soccer athletes.
I am so proud of you right now. So you would pick athleticism over skill and talent for our USA soccer team?? You must admit that white people have not proven to be the most skilled with the the ball in the USA. Remember I am speaking in general and not just of a few players.
Do you think white people are better athletes than black people too?? I would make a better case for black people if athleticism would be my preference for our usnmt. Skill and talent would have to be Hispanic. Not just Mexican.
Wow - you say white people are not skilled? You are a racist. How dare you make a point counter to my point. What is the weakness of the hispanic player? Why don't you address that - what a racist.
I will answer your stupid question Again. if I had a pick a flaw I would pick the following. IN general, in USA, Hispanics size. In general Latinosshow to be more skilled than white people at soccer. That surprises you? Does it surprise you that black people show more skill at basketball than white people in general? Or is that race baiting? ? Lol.
Perhaps now you see how ridiculous you are.
I never said white people were not skilled dumby. I said Hispanics show to have more skill. Do you disagree that black people are more athletic than white people?? Or do you feel more comfortable talking about Hispanics and are too scared to talk about black people?? Thus is funny. I will use this conversation as a future reference. Thanks.
You said "white people have not proven to be the most skilled" - you are a racist. How dare you state your opinion about white people. RACIST!!
If me saying my opinion in who is more skilled in general is racist then we are both racist my brother. You generalized about Mexicans having poor sporting behavior and white people being more athletic but still too scared to say anything about black people I see. Great point of reference. I am putting this one in my favorite!! Thx brother!!
EXACTLY! You are so ignorant you could not even see what I was trying to do but I think you FINALLY may be on the path to understanding your bias and ridiculousness - I did exactly the same thing you did - made a point and then when you countered that point acted like I couldn't take it and played the victim and cried racist. PLEASE tell me you see the correlation. I don't think white people should be the majority on the US MNT - I have always said I want the best athletes regardless of race. Thanks for proving my point and I do hope you learn something from this.
Gordon, I was being sarcastic. My opinion of Hispanics having more skill and technical ability in general is well founded. Just like your opinion on athleticism. I just think skill should be picked over athleticism. I believe if we did that we would find many more Hispanics on our usnmt. For you to bring up negative Sporting behaviotr for Mexicans only and say that is something you don't want on our national teams is plain STUPIDITY and there is no good reason to even state since many USA white and black athletes have shown equal or even worse sporting behavior in major events making your point extremely weak.
You choose to ignore that fact even though it has everything to do with sporting behavior in our country. How can you say it is very important to you but then not address this issue for white and black players as well?? STUPID. The problem is you don't know how to handle the notion of having a majority of Hispanics player on the usnmt and ran out of political ways of stating your case.
You do understand what I did, right? Your irrelevant rantings make it hard to know for sure. You did not talk about white or black players - you made a point about hispanics - that is why I was not addressing those races AL - do you understand that? Same way I made the false statement I think the majority of the US MNT should be white - I did that to set you up - understand? I make a criticism of your point with sporting behavior and you go Al Sharpton crazy - calling me a racist, asking me to talk about other races - understand? I did the same with my false statement after you commented on it - you criticized white players and so I called you a racist - understand? I had to act like an idiot so you could understand but it is not working obviously. Basically, you made a point and I criticized it with the issue with sporting behavior and you lost it and I am fairly certain you place little value on sporting behavior in the first place. And I gave specific examples of the Mexican MNT players and did address the US MNT saying I could not think of one incidence of poor sportsmanship with them in the series. I want the best athletes on the MNT and want players that demonstrate good character - you criticized that "I am tired of that bad excuse of the best athletes in Usa dont pick soccer first." Remember? I did not freak out and call you a racist. You want a team full of hispanic players and clearly would prefer them to be Mexican and you don't give a crap about sporting behavior. I critiqued that and you freaked out and called me a racist. so you take your team full of Mexicans or hispanics and don't care about the sportsmanship and I will take the best athletes regardless of race on my team and pick players with good character and we will play and you will lose every time.
Dp you understand I was being sarcastic? What exactly dis you set me up for?? To continue to say the same things I have already been saying?? Great!! Look dude. You bring up Charles Barkley as a solution to goalie for our USA team as a top athlete for that position but you completely disregarded this player's sporting behavior that immediately after you stated was very important to you. My opinion on Hispanics dominating the USA roster, on the other hand, was addressed with this issue and using random examples. Makes no sense. If you don't want stay off topic you shouldn't change it. My point dealt with only skill and talent. You changed it to sporting behavior. I elaborated on your stupid comment and now you find it inconvenient. You want to generalize our argument to everything to do with the Mexican player even though it was only about how much more smiled they are. You want to talk about their diet as well??
This is how stupid your point is. What made you think I don't care about sporting behavior?? Because I think highly of the Hispanic player??
You said "Why would character have anything to do with how a player should be selected given any of these examles in Usa sports?" You are dishonest again. Ive already explained I was referring to Barkley when just talking about athletes so I don't need to keep repeating that - you are just race-bating. The issue was the fact you would like to see the US MNT dominated by hispanics and mostly Mexicans - you are racist and biased. I told you some issues with that based on fact and you can't handle it - deal with it - Mexican players have not shown sporting behavior in the past, sorry, deal with it and it alone - don't race-bait, try and stand up for your point instead of crying like a baby about other races and people - you sound like a 3 year old. If I brought up diet you would just say 'what about white people and black people and their diet.'
I never stated Hispanic s were perfect. I stated that they were simply more skilled in general. That's it. Sporting behavior was not in the conversation. You decided to go off topic. You bring up Charles Barkley. He is not Hispanic. Off topic. I counter both of these off topics and you decide it is not on topic now?? B.S. You are are a typical hipocritical racist. This is not Mexico? So you meant style of play and no racial intent?? Off topic again. I was talking about USA born Hispanics/Mexicans which should be considered as American as anybody else born in USA. So why would Mexico have to do with my More Hispanics on USA team?? The problem us people like you can not yet accept that Hispanics are true Americans as well. You are just learning to accept that black people are equal to white people. You see Hispanics as a threat even though we will be the majority population in a few years in USA.
You did only refer to Barkley when speaking about athleticism. Agreed. Why didn't you bring up his sporting behavior though? I was o.ly talking about skill and talent in Hispanics. Why id you decided to bring up sporting behavior in Mexico players then?? I was talking about USA born Hispanics as wel.
So only Mexicans havcnot shown good sporting behavior?? What does that have to do with Mexican Americans.?? Do you have the same tendencies as English people do?? Do black people have the same tendencies as Africans?? Can you deal with that?? STUPID. Your argument makes no sense but please don't stop. I will geteverybody Togo back to this and see my point.
You see bringing up the diet is as stupid as what you brought up. Why did you choose not to stick with the topic of skill and talent in the Hispanic player?? Was sporting behavior the best you could do??
You see Gordon, you counter my point of view of Hispanic skill with Mexico's sportsmanship simply because you don't accept Hispanic Americans aswhat they are, Americansns. You insist on looking at them as foreign. Your idioitic points generalize all non USA and USA born Hispanics. That simply makes no sense when you say you dontcare where their from. You are arguing against yourself. You are trying clean up your own ness and just digging a deeper hole.
So I did not say Torres and Gomez deserved more looks? That would seem to indicate I consider them Americans. More dishonesty and lies and race-baiting. You certainly have twisted your comments between Mexicans and Hispanics - or do you deny that? You said "Mexican Americans are the best Soccer Athletes in USA." You then said "Mexico the opppsjte. We should learn from this country soccer wise and stop trying to come up with dumb excuses." So why is it then a problem for me to address the qualities of the Mexican player if that is who you want the US to emulate? You think it is racism. I think it is a legitimate point to address - sporting behavior is a factor in player selection - if you don't accept that and don't accept that as a possible flaw in YOUR point then you are what I suspect you are - biased, racist, unaware of anything to do with Mexicans or Hispanics, and ignorant of the facts. You can't deal with the truth - I tell you the U17 had 5-6 hispanics on it and lost - you play victim and say they should have had 9 hispanics. I tell you the U20 Mexican team tied a US club team and you play victim and say it was not their best team. I tell you the US has a 10-5-2 (or something like that) record vs Mexico and you play victim and make an excuse about friendlies -SEE A TREND? I make a point about sporting behavior and you have never addressed it - you just race-bait and don't address it. Try and be honest.
Why is it race baiting to get your input on sporting behavior from other races in USA?? You insist on me being the one to change the topic yet I was simply commenting on the Hispanic American being more skilled. You turned it into sporting behavior in Mexico players. Are you saying they are both the same to you?? That's a legitimate point? Me asking your opinion on Black and white sporting behavior in USA is not a legitimate question?? If you are worried about sporting behavior in USA teams shouldn't you address all examples of a races involved?? Shouldn't you use examples of actual American players then?? My statement on learning's from teams like Mexico was un reference to my same topic, skill and talent. You turned it into something different that you don't to follow up on.
So you saying Torres and Gomez deserving another look makes it ok to generalize all Hispanics as unclassy for the actions of a few nonAnericans?? Thx.
I will say it again. In my opinion Mexican Americans are the most skilled players in USA. What does Sporting Behavior have to do with that comment? We should learn from countries like Mexico since it is obvious they are doing things with winning pretty much everything in the last year. The results are there. USA is going backwards. What does this have to do with Sporting Behavior or USA being Mexico, Stupid? Wheb somebody wants to learn from someone else it usually means learning the good and not the bad like skill , development, player identification, etc. If Mexico were to learn something from USA, like in Basketball for example, they certainly would not want to focus on negatives like poor sporting behavior from the Nbas stars. You make no sense and you are stupid.
Is there a better country, sporting behavior wise that we should emulate? USA is certainly not the best example of sporting behavior. Why don't we first stay on the skill topic and then we can talk about sporting behavior. But to critisize another country's sporting behavior without first looking at ourselves is kind of dumb. That issue eliminates itself.
Gordon you addressed my topic on skill in Hispanics with sporting behavior I. MEXICANS. I addressed your sporting behavior in Mexicans topic with sporting behavior in Black and white Americans. You felt you had to change the topic from skill to sporting behavior. I felt you should address all sporting behavior in USA. So somehow I changed the subject? You are very stupid man.
You are a moron. You make a point about Mexicans and emulating them. Right? Do I need to paste your quote again? Are you really that ignorant? You made a point about skill AND emulating Mexico. Surely I don't need to paste that again. I address an issue with that point. You simply cannot grasp that sporting behavior is a legitimate part of player selection - you have no character and likely care little about character and likely have never coached at any significant level so you don't understand that and when you don't understand something (which is probably often) you just claim racism and try and bring other races into it. If you had simply said 'well, yes, there have been issues and that is not the aspect of the Mexicans I want as part of the US MNT' then this would be over. If Mexico wanted to learn from the NBA stars then absolutely there would be positives and negatives to take from that - does that help you? But, be careful if you comment on the negatives then some race-baiter like you may call you a racist.
Emulating them in skill stupid. Who is changing the subject? Did I say lets be like Mexico in Sporting Behavior? Stupid. Is the USA known for excluding talent if the Sporting Behavior isn't there?? You did mention Barkley. Or is it just in soccer player selection and no where else? You are stupid. Why would I say there are negative aspects of the Mexican player that I don't want on our usmnt without looking at black and white negative sporting behavior examples here in the USA?? Are we calling the kettle black now?? What does Mexico's sporting behavior have to do with my initial topic, Skill?? Who changed the subject, stupid??
Exactly I made a point of skill and emulating Mexico's skill. SKILL is the key word. So Waugh does Sporting Behavior have to do with it?? You bringing that up has absolutely nothing to do with my overall point of picking HISPANIC AMERICANS. Nothing. Mexico is Mexico. America is America. But if you did want to address Sporting Behavior in one race it would be responsable to do the same for all races in USA or else this subject is meaningless. Comprebde Stupidity?
You continue to be a moron and a race-baiter. I'm not going to keep telling you when I brought up Barkley and tell you why I won't discuss other races - if you don't understand by now then you have a learning disability. I now feel like you can't handle the fact of sporting behavior I brought up nor the fact that is certainly reasonable to examine all aspects considering player selection - skill, character, athleticism, etc. The NBA example was a good one but you still can't accept things. In the end, it just proves my point - you have no character and that perhaps it is something to examine should we try and "....learn from this country soccer wise and stop trying to come up with dumb excuses."
I can handle sporting behavior but what did thatvhave to do with SMILL IN HISPANICS SOCCER?? It seems you want to dictate what topics go together. I am suppose to understand that sporting behavior goes with skill in Hispanics but you can't accept that sporting behavior in Hispanics in USA also have to do with othefraces in America?? STUUPID. So if you want to address all aspects of player selection why can't you address the same in ALL AMERICANS?? STUPID. Yes I can address and will address your sporting behavior topic when you choose to address a American tendencies and we can evaluate exactly what is best for usnmt thus way. To only look at the faults of one race when it involves more races is pointless. Afterall the overall objective is to select the best options isn't it??
FYI, I do coach and started a mostly Hispanic club. I do notice that other low income Hispanic clubs like ours display little discipline and unsporty behavior at times and it bothers me. But guess what, I have notice on a much more regular basis ignorant and blatant racism from. Parents, Coaches , Players and Refs who are white.. that too falls in the category of bad sporting behavior but to a much higher degree. I coach my players to always display the highest class in their everyday lives and is actually one of our trademark distinctions from all clubs. We are now working on the tardiness part. I enforce this telling my players that racist people are looking for any excuse to attack you or bad mouth you and if we really want to piss them off we should show how above their ignorance we are by ignoring their idiotic comments and just embarrass them with our skills. We smile at the bias refs and laugh at how parents enjoy a badly recede win even though they are dominated on the field. I also point out how a few logical opponents do acknowledge the reality of the game and commend us on our demeanor. Thats our win.
Whoa Luis!! Finally, a breakthrough. As to your first post, I have already told you numerous times why I bring up aspects of your point about wanting the US MNT majority Hispanic and to emulate Mexicans - it is fair to examine all aspects of your point. As for your second post, thank you for the honest comment. I agree that there is still racism in some white people. It sounds like you are on the right track with your team - I would only suggest to be sure your message is not as much about white people and racists as it is to have the focus on the positive things your players and families can do. If it is all about the evil white people then it can create a us vs them mentality and provides motivation to do harm to the evil white people or to be able to get back at the racists whereas perhaps the motivation should simply be to work hard, have discipline, be sporting, ignore the negativity, etc. Just a thought. I leave you with this - “Certain people tell us that we are picking on the poor. Many of those who accuse us are scholars and intellectuals, upset that we are not blaming everything on white people as they do. Well, only blaming the system keeps certain black people in the limelight but it also keeps the black poor wallowing in victimhood.” Good luck with your team.
All aspects of my point would include black and white players as I am comparing skills. You are stating sportingbehavior but refuse to address all Americans and are generalizing all Hispanics with the actions of Mexicans born in Mexico. Is this fair?? Since my topic was on skill that was what I felt we should emulate from Mexico. You decided to change the topic and address sporting behavior in Mexico players. The overall objective of our conversation was to determine who would be best for our Usnmt. I made points on talent anvskill and stated wy andwho. You made points on Sporting behavior but did not address everyone. I will do that for you. As I gave you an example of some white people accross USA displaying this type of negative behavior and some black people also have shown bad sporting behavior in national competition. Your Mexico foment has happened in Mexico and you should also state that this behavior has not been seen with our Mexican Americans in National competition when representing USA. That's should be the most important to you. Either way these facts make your points quite pointless. They al eliminate each other. Skill iscrhen still the determining factor in this case. Who are the most skilled?? We all know. You lose.
Well, a step backwards. If you say we should emulate Mexico then even if you were talking about skill it is okay to address other issues with that - its not really that problematic. You have a quick defense mechanism on you about race perhaps? As a coach of over 24 years, character will beat out skill without character every time - think Adu. I never lose.
Character can be defined in many ways. The Character to win is the most important in this case. It is safe to say that the Mexico team has this type of character strongly engraved, especially as of late, as we are using their character now as an example. Sporting Behavior is another subject and really only addresses the class in a player. Since Bad Sporting Behavior has not been exempt from any of the 3 major races in USA I don't really see why you insist on it. I used Mexico as an example for skill and now the will to win. Nothing more. I agree with you, let's not emulate the unclassiness they have displayed and let's also eliminate our own unclassy behavior many times displayed in our own USA teams. Also, let's not generalize all Hispanics/Mexicans with the actions of Mexico players because that would be ignorant. Let's not do the same with white or black peoiple and generalize them with Africans and Europeans. Let's look hard at who is more skilled in USa and it usually goes with who plays soccer more and shows more passion for it, Hispanics. Just like Black people with Basketball. Common Sense. You lose.
I finally see the problem with you. You are a coach who prefers the hard worker over the skilled player because it is easier to deal with the hard worker. I can see you picking the athletes over the talented and skilled at tryouts. Can't blame you. Mostly Everybody else in USA does the same. This is why you are not a big fan of the Hispanic Player and a bigger fan of the White Player. In general White People are harder workers. Can't argue there. My mission as a coach is to have both races learn from each other. Extremely hard but not impossible. I am a bigger fan of talent and skill. it's easier to teach work ethic than skill. Skill and Taelnt have to be showcased. Your mentality is what I beleive to be wrong in this country. The Skill and Talent are not there in the white negborhoods as much but only because soccer is not lived the same way as in other countries. Since this is not there you focus on formations, tactics, defense, set plays, work harder attitude, etc. at the youngest of ages. This is why you and people like you push non skill topics, as a way of redeaming your flaws and trying to make a case for your only values. Therefore, we have robots on the USa teams. No self expression. We will be exposed more than ever before with these new 4-4-2 or 4-3-3 formations. You should instead take the great challenge of combining both strengths so you can eliminate both weaknesses instead of trying to argue against one of them. In the end a skilled player will motivate more to play. A hrad worker with limited skill will not have the same appeal.
I never lose my friend. As to your first post, I certainly agree all races have issues with sporting behavior. You wanted me to not be politically correct so while I did use examples of Mexican players in response to your point I do think there is the 'little discipline' within the hispanic player at times and generally and if I am allowed to stereotype - just chill and allow it! I am trying to get us to a better place. Now, as I said, there are issues with all races and further there are many hispanics and Mexicans and Mexican or hispanic Americans that are not that way at all - Ricardo Clark, Hernandez, Gomez etc. I love watching Hernandez - he NEVER blames his teammates and works hard. You even agreed as much with your statement on the team you coach.
As to your second post, you are off base. I don't pick the harder worker because they are easier to deal with - it is many factors. And I don't not pick the skilled players - I love skilled players but, in my experience, the skilled players with no work ethic and bad attitudes are not worth it - they will give you moments of brilliance but then will let you down when you need them the most or they will infect team chemistry or do something stupid off the field - would you want Ballotelli - probably one of the more gifted scorers and athletes in the EPL - I would not take him on ANY team - no way. What about Valderamma? Not me. Beautiful skill but does not move, does not play defense - those lazy attacking mids are no more - they work now - Silva, Modric - they are players I would want. I want to win and, despite what you think, I am not racist - I would pick the best players at tryouts regardless of race - if it was a skilled hispanic and they were one of the best and I saw no character issues they are in - I want to win too bad! Not sure which is harder to train work ethic or skill - good question. I have taken MANY, MANY chances on talented, skillful players that had suspect character and they never work out - maybe you are right and that is players of all races and many white players. I always think I can turn them and they never get turned - Ballotelli will never turn it around...NEVER. What you don't understand is we coaches are always talking about the lack of skill with the soccer players in the US - ALWAYS, non-stop discussions. When I coached high school, I created pick-up games for the players over the summers - no coaching, just free play. I started a league where one night a week we would take a futsal ball and play indoors. It is so hard to recreate that street soccer and, yes, the white kids rarely do it.
I said I see it in other Hispanic Clubs. I run my club differently. I believe white people over emphasize discipline in sports to the point that it goes against development. Brazilians are really laid back but play with a passion. There are many stories of how Brazilians love to party and discipline issues but are the most talented hands down. If you bench a U9 because he was late or didn't show up to a practice is it really worth it to stunt his development by just having fun to teach him discipline? I have learned that it is usually the parent that is undisciplined. How about enforcing team structure to the point that the kids is more worried about team shape than being creative with not focusing so much on being out of position defensively. In my opinion there is a fine line between discipline and free play.
I agree with you and tell my young players everyday that nowadays everybody plays defense and has to be inahape and willing to give 110%. Would I take a Bolletelli? Depends on the age. If he is 3-15 years old, how do you not take him?? That's where a realty good coach gets the challenge of making that player the best he can be. Your problem is, and again this is normal in USA, you challenge yourself to coach to win and not to develop. If you base your player selection, practices, games on winning focus you will always pick the more Athletic, hard working, disciplined young players and exclude the talented but otherwise flawed players, missing out on true skill. Effect example is basketball. AAU is huge business but the best players come from the hood where little discipline or hard workers come from when compared to the disciplined players from white neigborhods. The real coaching is done in turning players around not winning U9 games.
Discipline can be a broadly defined word - I think you are thinking of it in the line drills and tactical rigidity and such. I think of it in terms of sporting behavior and character. Saying 'having fun' to teach discipline is a bit much but teaching a kid discipline and punctuality and responsibility will last him or her a lot longer than their soccer career. I do hope you would never sacrifice morals over development or winning. That would be a tragedy (of course, at U9, when they are driven by their parents and they come late that is, yes, a bit of a different scenario). I doubt Ballotelli had a bad attitude at age 3 and I think players at a younger age are worth taking a risk on - not sure when they can no longer change but it never happened when I was a college coach - once a bad attitude, always a bad attitude. Discipline and work ethic and creativity are not mutually exclusive - they can be combined in players - Xavi is a great example. Many people always say coaches only pick the athletic player - most of those that say that are parents of smaller players - as I mentioned the US U17 team had several smaller creative players. Smaller creative players are also not mutually exclusive of discipline - you can have both.
Why is it called taking a risk on a kid that struggles with discipline?? A coach is suppose to teach and mold. I don't know that smaller players are not as athletic or bigger athletic players are not as skilled. Barcelona smalled but skilled or Brazil big and skilled. In my case my son is big, strong, athletic and skilled. Development is always first in my book. Hispanic s are the best students. :)
Discipline is always first in my book. I suppose it depends on the level you coach - in college you are paid to win, same depending on the situation in high school and same at the big clubs at older ages - discipline problems can affect all other members of the team and the coach has a responsibility to the team. That said, we all have discipline problems at all ages and all levels and I never give up on a player and bend over backwards to develop them and teach them to be better people. Agreed on the size thing.
It comes down to the coach and his capabilities of instilling discipline in his players. Some are more capable than others and this is when the coach's character comes into play. Every coach in USA is paid to win at mostly any age. This is why we end up with untalented players at the older ages. The players needed to win are the big, strong, fast and disciplined at the youngest of ages excluding the talented ones many times. Nobody wants to risk not winning. How can thiscgo with development 3-15 years old? My son was constantly recruited from his height and athleticism as top state goalie by the top regional team but they did not want to take the time to work on his field play as he was securing many wins. I kept him with me for this reason and now he is a top forward in the region at U13. Can't imagine where he wouldn't be if I hadn't started a club.
Not to back track but the reason we don't win is because we don't get the best athletes.
The best athletes overall or the best soccer athletes? You think Messi would play basketball if American but he is only 5'3". Average top soccer athlete height in the world is probably 5'6"-5'8" if you look at Barcelona. Top athletes here by your criteria are over 6'. Don't you think there are tall top athletes in other countries as well? I don't see many 5'6" top athletes in any of the major sports in USA. Next excuse.
Name top 20 USA Athletes that you think would make great soccer players and please include character.
Top 20 USA Athletes
Best athletes, period. Get them to play soccer at an early age. Lets not go back to distorting facts - Messi is 5'7. Barca's average height looks more like about 5'9 or 5'10. I did not say top athletes are over 6 foot - we had made so much progress - please do not state things I did not say - I even mentioned that I was talking about the 5'6-5'8 athletes that are still choosing other sports as well as tall athletes. I want best athletes regardless of height, weight, or race. I will give you a few examples - John Elway - cmid, Wayne Gretzky - amid, Polamalu as dmid, Walter Payton as striker, Darrell Green as outside back. James Worthy as outside mi.
What is the average height of those athletes you just mentioned along with 6 more you can think of? My points are not about being bias. My son will grow to be 6'4"6'6" soccer player at least. So picking.g the biggest, strongest fastest favors us. But he should be picked for his technical ability first. You did not say anything about height but you did say our best athletes are picking basketball and football which average height is well over 6'2". That average is not the same for the Spain teams. My point is Americans like you assume that what we believe to be top athletes would automatically become the best soccer players. Facts say otherwise. Craftiness is much needed in soccer. More than muscles and speed.
So now you are saying the best soccer players are short? Now are you saying good athletes cannot become crafty and creative? I told you before it is not about the 6'8 guys picking basketball or football - it is about those guys but also about the shorter guys that may not be NFL or NBA bound that are picking football and basketball. If you have never been a high school coach you cannot understand. THIS IS NOT ABOUT HEIGHT. NOR RACE. Walter Payton was 5'10, Gretzky is 6'0, Elway is 6'3, Polamalu is 5'10, Darrell Green is 5'9, James worthy is 6'9.
No, I am saying it is wrong to assume that our tall athletes would be great at soccer given the average height in the rest of the soccer world and the average height of the best soccer players in history. So you agree that its a cultural preference to pick these 2 sports along with baseball before they pick soccer? Average hieggt of those players you mentioned is over 6ft.
Hakeem Olajuwon would not make a good keeper, Kobe Bryant would not make a great center mid,Steve Nash would not make a great att mid, Ronnie Lott would not make a good center back - take the blinders off Luis - come one, seriously? Yes, the best athletes are picking other sports. The average height of the players was swayed due to Worthy obviously BUT this is not about height or race.
Olajuwan and Nash both did play soccer as their first choice andfrom countries where is soccer is a more common choice. I am not saying they would not make good players. Now that you admit that it is not in USA culture to pick soccer as a top sport, can you tell me what race you would say does pick soccer first in USA? It is hard not to notice that all of the top athletes in USA that you mentioned, not one is Hispanic. We have Hispanics as the best soccer athletes in the world, yet we can't produce any in USA??
Who has the blinders on?? Oh wait, I know your answer. Its not about race. I bring it up because it is very curious to me given all these facts. Are there any Hispanics in your High School? What sport are they picking first/
Hispanics are not always the best athletes - I don't know what a "soccer athlete" is - I assume many or most hispanics pick soccer?? The high school I coached at did not have many hispanics. The US is getting killed right now in men's soccer - you think the solution is to pick hispanics who you deem the best "soccer athletes" - I think the solution is to pick the best athletes, period, regardless of race - some may well be Hispanics, some may be white, some may be black - I don't care as long as they pick soccer. Luis - ask yourself if you are biased - truly as yourself - look deep inside and see it from other perspectives.
If you don't know what a soccer athlete is then how can you say Hispanics are not always the bestathletes? Its not that I deem them, the results and history make it a fact. My solution is also to pick the best athletes that pick soccer first. It just so happens that in USA they are Hispanics. I seem bias to you because I am Hispanic but if a white person said this it would make perfect sense because its logical. I am a basketball player. I could have played F1 but played in Mexico. Even thought I wish to see more Hispanics in the NBA it is obvious to me why black paople dominate. It is in their culture well engraved.they play with a special passion and swagger. It would be stupid for me to argue that Hispanics could dominate the NBA anytime soon because I understand it is not lived the same way in our culture. I love basketball. I understand the same with soccer. I coach it. I see exactly where the talent is and why it is there. What's bias about that?? I think you are trying too hard to argue about something you don't understand.
Not going to work until we get the BEST athletes not just take the best athletes that choose soccer - does not matter if they are hispanic or not.
The best athletes choose soccer?? Again, you assume that the best athletes picking football and basketball would automatically become the best soccer players in the world. This in no way is a gaurantee, especially given worldy facts about top soccer players. Lets take common factors in the top athletes. Height- the best players in the world in history are and have been under 5'8". USA top athletes average well over 6'. The only position that height is crucial is goalie and even there the best goalies average about 6'3". Skill- Soccer is played with a high degree of foot coordination which the average USA player has shown little of. USA player have shown a good talent with eye to hand coordination but this in no way translates into foot coordination. Sped and strength would be a plus but mean nothing without skill. We are already bigger, stronger and faster than many of our opponents. You seem to think that if we were bigger and faster we would be better. Typical.
At the moment it does matter because the fact is and will remain that Hispanics pick soccer first. The fact is and will remain that white and black athletes will continue to pick these other sports for many years to come. Get your head out of your ass and be realistic. I win. You lose. I am done here.
You are so biased in your ways and really distort facts so that one day we can have an all-hispanic US MNT - I am convinced that is your only motive. You are obviously a club coach with little real coaching experience that apparently played basketball as your main sport - even though you could have had a DI selection (never heard that before). If you think the best athletes in the US regardless of size would not make great soccer players you are sadly mistaken and completely misguided. Cruyff was 5'11, Beckenbauer 5'11 1/2, Di Stefano was 5'10, Socrates was 6'4, Zidane was 6'1 - there are many of the world's best that were tall just as many are short - Pele, Messi, and Maradona - GET OVER YOUR BIAS and stop distorting the facts. You should be done because you are a racist imbecile who is dishonest - your hero is probably Rafa Marquez and you probably think it is okay what he did the other night - that is why people like you never will have any real influence in the game - because you have no character and because you are biased to the point of idiocy. So quit your lying, quit teaching young kids to hate white people and act like victims, and PLEASE quit coaching. You will always be a loser and you have lost this one big-time.
Difference is Messi, Maradona and Pele were the best ever. Not tall and Hispanic. Wow facts really anger you. I deal with people like hoy all the time. I used to beat em up but now know how to handle politically. Its fun. Rafa, a regular starter on Barcelona for many years. I wonder who is classier him or Barkley?? You will be hearing about my players amigo and I will be there to say I told you so.
That post confirms how big of an idiot you are - you can't acknowledge facts - it's like saying the future of mens USA basketball must all be in the 6'6 range and black because Michael Jordan is the best of all-time - YOU ARE CLUELESS. You used to beat people up like you were offered a DI basketball spot - you are a liar, a man of no character who is so envious of the white people and so bitter about white people that your whole life's worth is crying racism and, worse, being responsible for the youth in this country - maybe one day one of your players will grow up to be a liar and a victim under your tutelage or maybe they will kick someone in the face and you will proclaim them as a hero - I have no doubt you think Marquez is a hero - because you are blinded by your jealousy and your anger. You are nothing but one of a million foreign coaches who has zero knowledge of the game, zero understanding of the sport, zero ability to demonstrate discipline and character BUT who thinks they know everything simply because they are Hispanic (or from someplace else). You are nothing in the soccer world except an anonymous race-monger who writes ignorant posts and you will never be anything more.
Wow you are truly stupid. Like Isadi before, the reason black have dominated basketball for over 30 years and will continue to do so for another 30 at least is that it is a big part of their culture like in no other. Every race has its athletes but they specialize in basketball. Its putting 2 and 2 together dumby. Who do you always see playing pickup basketball anywhere ? I said I was god enough to play F1. Never said I was offered anything. You are really quick to judge people aren't you? So now you have a problem with me showing my kids how to intelligently defending themselves from people like you? That's not teaching them to hate. That's introducing them to reality and the history they conveniently do not admit in school. Like commuting genocide on the American Indian. Negating black people as many of their constitutional rights as possible. I could go on and on.
You see people like you will not argue against the fact that black people dominate basketball and will continue to do so for a long time because of 2 reasons. You could not avoid it any longer and it is politically incorrect now. Same will happen with soccer for same reasons. You are the reason H.S. and College soccer sucks and is unwatchable. No Skill but plenty of aimlessly running. That's what your eraof coaching will be remembered by. ThT is what you contributed to the game. Nothing. I bet me U13s could teach your kids how to play. Lets scrimmage!!
Wow, more lies and deceit - "good enough to play F1" - what a joke. I can make a reasonable assumption what you are telling your kids - same thing Al Sharpton tells his community - it's all the white people's fault. I don't need to argue against black people being the majority in basketball because it is a obvious point - who cares? That does not mean Hispanics will dominate the US MNT. And who would want people like Rafa Marquez on the team? I know you would because you don't care about character. You are a racist. Please stop the influence in your community and with your team - please. They don't teach the facts about the Indians in school? They did when I grew up. More lies from you. Try and be an honorable man.
Racist, you are generalizing all Hispanics with the actions of Rafa Marquez. That's you obsession and your only argument against me I see. Funny. You won't argue against black people dominating basketball now because it is socially unacceptable but people exactly like you were totally against the best players even playing pro sports in USA probably questioning black peoples character along with the color of their skin and generalizing them all the same for the actionsvof a few. Nothing new there. I will continue to teach my kids about this hipocritical system that sadly enough includes soccer and how to work it in their favor. You are a declining breed. Unavoidable.
You want the US MNT to be majority hispanic and I want the best athletes regardless of race - who is the 'declining breed' and who is the racist? I have complimented Hernandez, Gomez, and others so you continue to be a bald-faced liar. Black people are the majority in the NBA - I already said that - more lies. "how to work it in their favor" makes you one of the worst people for your community. You are a U13 coach who knows nothing and is nothing and I am sure your players will see that if they already don't. Do them, and your son, a favor - stop coaching.
I want the best too but I think Hispanics are the best in USA. You say you want the best but make a point only against Hispanics by ignorantly generalizing all of them for the actions of a few. So if you think so highly of hernandez and Gomez, then Character on our USmnt with a majority Hispanic team is a non issue, correct. There is enough great Hispanic talent to pick from, so they can leave out the bad character ones if needed. If you do not see that this USA system is designed to have minorities fail them you are the biggest hipocrit in USA. You think it's a coincidence of generations on how long Black people were negated their rights as HUMAN Beings in USA ?? What has USA done for the American Indian ? These are facts and tnendencies that must be addressed. It is a responsability that we must all share. My players love me and are the most classy team in Illinois, because of my coaching. They understand to respect themselves and the rich culture they have when compared to others. They hold their heads up high and deal with racism and ignorance with class and higher level of humanity. I am proud of them and they are proud of themselves. People like you can't stand it but can't do anything about it even though they have tried. You could only learn to respect it.
You acknowledge the obvious but fail to acknowlegde the reason and translate this to soccer as it is exactly the same thing. If you want the best athletes to pick soccer first you must make it attractive to them. How are you going to do this with non tecnical or skilled players that only run and hit ?? Black people made the sport much more attractive to watch and motivated more and more people to play with swagger. Before Bob Cousy there was little creativity in the white community. Now we have players like Nash as a direct consequence. Without black people I am sure the NBA would not be as popular to watch. It is what it is.
I made the point about Hispanics addressing YOUR point - how hard is that to understand. I do believe sporting behavior is an issue with the hispanic player and tried to present that in a fair way by highlighting I was presenting that as a generalization and not referring to all hispanics but you haven't the fortitude to deal with that - you did on a few posts but otherwise you just told me I was a racist and that I needed to make comments on blacks. The way you are addressing your team above sounds fine but comments such as "how to work it in their favor" and "I believe white people over emphasize discipline" are scary. Focus on the positives not the evil white people.
Playground basketball is not more fun to watch than fundamentally-sound TEAM basketball. Attracting the best athletes to soccer has to be done in the high schools and that is where US Soccer has failed - they have put all their efforts into club so they may win a few battles but they are losing the war. They can always see good soccer nowadays. The best athletes in high schools have full-time football and basketball coaches and AD's in their face to play those sports daily and, of course, it is a more popular sport in the mainstream media. US Soccer needed to fund ways to have soccer coaches in these schools. They can have the best youth manual and the best Academy system and the best drills but if they don't have the best athletes they will lose at the top level against other countries that are using their best athletes.
My point "included" Hispanics and was in reference to other ethnicities. You chose to only address Hispanics. By now don't you get it ?? For you to say that sporting behavior is an issue with the Hispanic Player and not want to say the same about non Hispanics makes no sense. If it's about picking the best Athletes with the Best "Character", shouldn't you adress all inv9olved ?? If you acknowledge that Black people and White people have on occasion shown bad sporting behavior, how is Rafa Marquez a point you are trying to make about the hispanic Player ?? That sounds like nothing else but HIPOCRITICAL. When it is clear that you have people focusi9ng on putting you down or trying to manipulate your success then we have to find ways to work the system in our favor and not have to retaliate in a negative way. White people generally do focus more on team defensive shape, timeliness, administrative services, paperwork, etc. than actually learning to master the skill. Hispanics are the opposite. Black people are also the opposite. The effect of Playground Basketball is fun to watch at the Pro level. The effect of an only Fundamentally sound basketball player is not. Examples- Michael jordan, Magic johnson, Isaih Thomas vs Stockton, Bill Walton, Kevin Mchale. I love Mchale but not nearly as attractive to watch than Barkley. Everybody pays to see creative dunks, no look passes, amazing dribbling, showmanship. Very few go to watch fundamentally sound teams. Hispanics are not picking Football or Basketball as their first sport. They are picking soccer. Let's not continue to make excuses of what could be or would be and let's pick the guys that are truly passionate of the sport and make it watchable.
You are a liar. "Mexican Americans are the best Soccer Athletes in USA." "Mexico the opppsjte. We should learn from this country soccer wise and stop trying to come up with dumb excuses." "Gordon, the U17 would had played much better if it had more 9 Hispanics as starters at the least." "When in fact we do get a majority of Hispanics on the usa natipnal teams we will then be a top soccer country." You are a liar and sound like a 12 year old kid that does not understand team concepts and their value over individual play - when you say "showmanship" is what you like to see then that says everything abut you - an immature liar that cares nothing abut integrity. I don't care if hispanics are picking soccer first - if they are not the best athletes and they demonstrate no character like you then they are useless to the US MNT - and we tried it with the U17 team already - did not work.
So the U17 did not show good character because they had Hispanics? Yes I did say those things but also explained why I thought White and Black people were not as skilled as Hispanics. You clearly don't want Hispanics to be thecmost on usmnt no matter how bettevthey are. Hispanics are the best and are demonstrating great character as proud Americans. Do you have a problem with that?
How do you feel about the USA basketball team having 95% black people on it mostly? Do ever question their character? Oh I forgot. You are too scared to answer that. Pussycat.
I have a problem with YOUR statement about Hispanics and I addressed it and you just made excuses except for one time. Try honesty and self-awareness.
Yea, I thought so. Your a racist but we will prevail. You won't matter.
More excuses and victimization. I pity you and any you influence.
You can pity them on your couch watching them on TV playing the beautiful game.
Tried it - did not work - doubt your racist desire of a full US MNT will ever be all Hispanic - try and get out of your shell.
I bet somebody said the same thing 50 years ago with black people and basketball. Unavoidable. Do you think those people were seen as racist back then? How about now?
By the way, those U17 did not have majority Hispanics
I know you want the team to be majority Hispanic (mostly Mexican American) and that is your only goal - you want zero white people on the US MNT and as far as I can tell zero black people - maybe you would allow one or two as tokens. Your reference to black basketball players 50 years ago is another race-baiting web of lies - black people were victims of racism and were treated unequally - that has not been proven to be the case with US soccer as I see it - I am aware there is still racism and racist people but when you have 5-6 Hispanics on the U17 team with a Hispanic coach and Hispanics are 16% of the population then that is a pretty good indicator of US Soccer efforts towards inclusion. The best athletes need to be picked regardless of race - I think there are good athletes of all races - that his where you and I differ - you are blinded by your racial anger and victimhood. Get with Al Sharpton and see how he does it - might give you some tips. You are a nobody coach with what a D license - maybe a C - who knows - played basketball at some real high level (so you say) but the white man kept you down so you chose ot to go to college (smart). Try not to be racist and try and always tell the truth.
I just want the best Americans on the usmnt. The ones that show the most passion and love for the game. The majority in this case would have to be Hispanics. "MAJORITY". Unequal treatment at the hands of who? I am working reallyhard so my people are not the victims and conquer their destiny.
Our best athletes are not all hispanics and therefore that is not a solution.
Our best soccer players are. Are black people our best basketball athletes? No. They are our best basketball players. Dumby. Get your racist head out of your racist ass.
Crying racism again- surprising. Did you call Al Sharpton - you must have - any time someone says something against your point of view you cry and claim racism and go tell your team about the evil white man and how to 'work the system.' Do you need some tissues for your tears? Go be a victim and claim the white people are out to get you and make sure and tell your kids that - no wonder Rafa Marquez is the way he is - maybe you coached him somewhere along the line - he just cant stand to see white boy Donovan get the best of him - poor, poor victim.
You can admit that black people are dominating basketbdsdall only because its an overwhelming fact but apparently you will not admit as to why. If Hispanics are not always the best athletes, then surely black people aren't always the best athletes. So then why Oh why are they dominating the NBA? Could it be that they are more passionate about it than any other ethnicity? Is this race baiting or is this a legitimate example? Now translate it to soccer. STUPID.
I doubt Rafael worries about Donovan since he has had a much more successful career. I don't know this but I will bet anything that Rafa presently makes much more than Donovan in the MLS. Yea, he is getting the best of him.
Who gives a crap you race-baitIng imbecile - just pick the best athletes regardless of race. You are missing the point - blacks and hispanics surely play more street soccer in general than whites - that is not the point - the point is we need our best athletes to do that and choose soccer and that won't be all Hispanics as your racist hope would believe. As to your Marquez comparison - real shocking you could not face that and admit he is of little character - you are blinded by race - once again you cry tears and make excuses and lie - it must be hard to be you - maybe though it is easy to lie and have no honor like Marquez - head to head US over Mexico 10-5-2 I think it was - that is Marquez and Donovan's era and the Galaxy over Red Bulls to knock them out and Donovan goal in 2-0 win vs Mexico when it mattered most in WC - maybe you are saying Marquez did not throw the ball at Donovan - maybe it was an accident - trying to think like you as a racist liar - maybe he wanted Donovan to have the game ball for such a fine game - typical of such a low life to try and make it about money - you have no integrity.
It is the point stupid. Wherever stretch soccer is played in th world the best soccer athletes are born. Its a general tendency that can be seen in basketball in the USA as well. Donovan vs Rafa?? Who cares?? Usually the better players play on better teams and get paid more money. You have a big problem with common sense. That's why you fail to see legitimate examples. Ok lets wait until we get the best athletes to pick soccer first. Whatever that means. I will be there to say I told you so. I will be happy to see the more passionate athletes prevail in USA soccer. We all know too well who they are but some of us want to fight it as much as possible. Inevitable.?
Hispanics and black people may certainly play more street soccer but you continue to miss the point - that does not make them better athletes - that makes them better technically and tactically BUT until we get our best athletes playing street soccer and playing soccer we are not going to win - try and understand the point - you can take a Hispanic and let him grow up with the game and play street soccer and then play for a great club but if he is not the best athlete then he will still get beat because he is playing against the best athletes from other countries who are doing the same thing. Donovan has obviously gotten the better of Marquez head to head which is the proper comparison in reference to my original comment.
It does make them better athletes "EVERYWHERE" and "ANYWHERE" in the WORLD. You have a perfect and close up example in the Black Community and Basketball. Most of the NBA Greats of all times grew up playing street ball in the hood. Why can't you acknowledge that fact? You really look like a huge Hipocrit now but thanks for the material. This is an excellent reference for me to show people about my point of what is accepted in this country. So what you are trying to say is that it is a huge coincidence that the black people making it in the NBA as Allstars both, play street ball and are great athletes ? How stupid and naive are you??
If it is a well known fact that the best Athletes just so happen to mostly come from street ball anywhere in the world why oh why aren't we looking in those places here in USA with regards to soccer?? You want to dwell on the fact that "until we get the best athletes pick soccer first" but will not acknowledge those who do pick soccer first because you are racist. WHen exactly do you project the "best" athletes picking soccer first in USA?? Let's focus on those that do at the moment and not worry about what could be or would be.
As a matter of fact I currently know of a few players that have gone unnoticed here in USA being scouted here in USA by Hispanic Countries. Maybe they have a different point of view of what the "best" athletes for soccer are.
You are an idiot. I guess what you are saying is even a bad athlete in basketball - lets use you as an example - could go play street ball all day long for years and years in your youth and then be one of the best athletes and make it to the NBA - wow - you are a genius. The players that played street ball and then went on to the NBA were obviously great athletes - are you saying they weren't until they started playing street ball? You are truly a revolution of idiocy. Sounds like you want the MLS and US MNT scouts to go the playgrounds and pick players - is that what you think happens in the NBA? The point is not that street soccer is good for development but who we are getting to play street soccer - that is still not our best athletes - if you want to focus on those that are playing street soccer right now then that is a different thread - do you have ADD? The point was why we failed to qualify for the Olympics and that is because we don't get the best athletes playing soccer - in the streets and elsewhere - it is not because US Soccer is racist and does not 'notice' hispanics - more race-baiting. Wow. I'll go get you some tissues.
Your point is tupid because the teams we lost to were not more athletic. They were more skilled. Canada picks hockey over soccer so they don't get their best athletes, according to you, and they beat USA. El Salvador was no where near as athletic as USA but was defenitely ge more skilled team.. the issue here is you see much more value in athleticism than skill. So even a bad athlete would make the NBA if he played in the street?????? Great material. Thx again. The best athletes can come from any social status but the "best players" come from street ball most of the time in basketball or soccer in the entire world. That is a fact. It is not an opinion you freaking idiot. Its also cultural. There is one ethnicity in USA picking soccer first in USA because it is a big part of their culture. Hispanics. It is not a big part of black and white people culture in USA and won't be anytime soon. That's a fact. Not an opinion stupid. Obviously we need to pick the best players from those that make it their prioritywhich we are not. Wow, you are dumb
The BIGGER point and FACT is that of course the best athletes can come from all walks of life BUT there seems to be an undeniable trend as to where the best players come from, which are a mix of the best athletes and the most skilled, STREET BALL. To make it really simple for you because you are not smart, if you took 10 TOP athletes and had them play under a structured environment their whole life and took another 10 top athletes and had them just play street soccer until they were about 14-15, the best allaround players would be the later 10-1. To play street soccer you must have soccer as a way of life in your culture. Basketball is a huge part of the black community's culture, therefore, we have the best black athletes dominating the NBA. Soccer is a huge part of the Hispanic people all over the world, therefore, the best soccer players are and have been mostly Hispanic. These are legitimate and factual examples that you choose to deny because you are small minded and racist. They usually go hand in hand along with being ignorant.
Wow. I am not sure the move not to attend college was a good idea for you - I know you 'could have played F1 (whatever that is). You have trouble understanding basic things. First, the teams we play against are getting their country's best athletes for the most part and they are better athletes than we are, period - yes, even the smaller countries we play against - do I need to bring up the Blaz Perez vs Steve Cherundolo comparison again for you? You can't understand or write basic english but I assume your memory is okay. The teams certainly may have been more skilled as well - that is not my point. I don't value athleticism over skill - that is just you lying again and making stuff up and trying to say I like big strong white guys over smaller hispanics - you are a liar and a race-baiter. Your comment that a bad athlete making the NBA is incomprehensible (that means not able to be understood) because that was me making fun of your point and pointing out that was what you were saying. I have never said great players do not get their start from the streets - maybe you should read the comments several times to try and understand them better - I said we need to get or best athletes playing street soccer. Do you understand that? You probably don't. Whatever I write you probably just translate it as white racist. That is great soccer is big part of the hispanic culture but that is irrelevant and has nothing to do with my point about getting better athletes of any race to play soccer. I have never devalued street soccer so your entire point is useless. The point is trying to get our best athletes involved in the soccer culture and to choose soccer - do I need to write this again for you or maybe draw pictures? I know you are a racist piece of garbage but try not to minimize players such as Franz Beckenbauer or Johann Cruyff or Zidane in discussions of best soccer players - I know they are evil white people but try and put the tissues down from your crying victimhood and see things clearly and fairly some times.
Wow really interesting arguments the fact that they are littered with insults makes this much more stimulating. First before I get going with my opinions I want to make sure I am not accused of racism, ignorance or small mindedness. Luis are you from Norway?
I propose like in the old NASL days a mandatory 3 hispanic player rule for the usa starting 11 at all levels Luis any opinions? It would be EOP for the soccer community.
You insist on pointing out that we do not have our best athletes picking soccer. How can this be true if it is a fact that Hispanics, a big part of USA, are in _fact picking soccer first, therefore we have great athletes picking soccer first in USA. Lets pick those now and maybe the other ethnicities will catch on and we will finally have all of our top athletes pick it first. But I know you won't accept that. Who is the victim here? You keep crying about race baiting when you don't want address legitimate comparisons. You would be surprised how well I do without acollege education.
Sam, I am 1/2 Norwegian. Thx for noticing. 3 would not be an adequate number of the soccer player ratio. JUST LIKE BASKETBALL with black people. By players I mean those that play everyday as much as they can and not just go to practice twice a week. Keep your argument inteligent and acknowledge facts and I am sure you won't here that from me.
Not sure I understand your retort. I would like to see a slow Onyewu replaced by Kobe....and Hedjuk replaced by Lebron and Jeff Agoos replaced by Adrian Peterson and so on and so on. The answer is not simply in the hipanic players being left behind it been the lack of glamour and appeal that soccer has in our culture and in our schools. Football and hoops will always be more popular.
This issue is all you ever talk about from reading all posts in other forums...does this make you a race baiter?
And furthormore what facts and data have you presented? All I have read is you opining about the hispanic player being left behind. DATA baby!!!
Sam, The Hispanic player is not being left behind in USA. He is simply being scouted better by their mother countries. What makes you or anybody think that Kobe or Lebron would make great soccer players ?? There are basketball players with good hands and bad hands as well as football players. Don't you think it's the same with foot coordination or the possibility?? It's easy to see who is more passionate about basketball in USA and where it is played with skill, flare and creativity, the HOODS. Why would it be any different in SOCCER? Do you need actual statistics of this ?? Football and Hoops will always be more popular. That's very good. But there are 2 crucial points on that very subject. 1. Hispanics in USA still take soccer over these 2. 2. Why is basketball more popular than ever before ?? Because of the creativity established by those who love it more, THE HOOD. Why don't you and Gordon put your thoughts together in one blog to see if you can come up with something better?
It seems like you think that because hispanics are picking soccer first they are great athletes - you aren't really that stupid are you? Wait, yes you are. You do know athleticism is different than skill, right? Maybe you don't know that. To imply that Kobe and LeBron would not make good soccer players further demonstrates your complete racist ignorance. To say basketball and soccer's popularity is all due to the fact many stars play pick-up in the hood is quite the naive stretch - there are many more facets to its appeal - I , for one, would rather see Larry Bird or John Stockton or Dennis Johnson or Ricky Rubio make a good hustle play or great pass then I would want to see LeBron go one on one with some 'hood' moves while the rest of his team just stands in the corner and watches. Messi was in a club team in Argentina by the time he was 5 and at Barcelona but the time he was 13. I think you would probably want to see someone try and meg the keeper from an impossible angle than pass to a wide open team mate with a better angle. You seriously must be about 18 or 19 years old - caught up in 'flash' and 'style' over substance. Street soccer is great and beneficial but there is much more to development of the top players than that and try and understand just because hispanics play street soccer that does not make them the best athletes and there are many white players that grow up playing street soccer as well.
White players playing soccer in the streets in USA? My point about Hispanics playing soccer as a first choice is not limited to street soccer. They play anywhere and everywhere they can because they assionate about it. They play in clubs and are usually the better tens in Ilinkis, California, Texas at the youth level. Those states usually establish. The bed teams in the nation. Coincidence? I never said Lebron or Kobe could not be top soccer players. I just don't think its a sure thing. If that were true you would have a bunch of 6'7" soccer players from other countries pick soccer first. That is far from the case.
Athleticism is different than skill?? Really?? So you think its a coincidence that these 2 traits come together in the hood and produce the best basketball players in the world? I enjoyed watching Bird as well but everybody else fell in love with Jordan, Magic, Isiah, Barkley, Lebton, Rose, Wade, Wilt, etc. That's a MAJORITY!!! STUPID!!! If you think white people are just as skilled as Hispanic people at soccer then you must agree that Hispanic people are just as athletic as whitevpeople, correct? Si what is the difference? Who plays soccer as a first sport as a culture OVERALL?? I rest my case. I have to stop with this blog. I have a few kids getting looked at for possible USA selection. Keep fueling that fire GORDON.
Sorry - white people can't possibly do such things - we are just athletic brutes who kick and run - does that make you happy and satisfy your racism? I think we already saw the team from Texas draw the U20 Mexican team was led by non-hispanic players. Try and rack your memory....I'll wait......okay, got it? Remember I said it has nothing to do with height and gave examples of players 6'0 and under - Walter Payton, Drew Brees, etc. All good athletes. Remember or are you really that stupid? Oh, wait, yes, you are.
If you think athleticism is the same as skill then you are even dumber than I thought. Bird played in the hood with the brothers as well you imbecile but did not play with that great 'flair' and individual selfishness that you so love - why is that? You include Wilt in that list - holy crap - for someone that could have played 'F1' basketball you sure don't know much about the game - Wilt as a 'flair' player?. In generic hispanics are more skilled than white people - I never said otherwise you race-baiting lying piece of crap. You think of things in racial animosity always - that is your whole identity. As to who are better athletes - does not matter just pick the best athletes regardless of race - let's just make sure we get the best athletes that have strong character - not someone like Rafa Marquez. You rest your case and lose as always.
I need to stay out of this.
But Luis one question who is a more athletic hoops player Derrick Rose or John Stockton? And who is a more skillfull soccer player Maradona or Michael Owen?
Coaches all over the world in all sports characterize players as "great athletes" or skillfull players and in some rare cases now pay attention here... both.
Ps I love the insults. Keep them flying!!
I actually spoke with a Mexico U20 technical trainer last wekk which was at the Dallas Cup and asked about that result. He said the FMF uses those types of tournament to look at. And tryout new talent and by no means was it a select team.this makes sense to me since they are dominating at the youth levels in WORPD competitions. No doubt that is a big win for the Texas teamiether way. I doubt they had majoritywhite people on it though. There might be a few white people playing pickup or street soccer but its 1-1,000 when compared to how much soccer Hispanics play in USA. No contest. Fact. IDIOT.
Excuses, excuses, excuses, go get more tissue paper for your tears - can't accept facts, keep blaming white people for all your problems and never accept responsibility for yourself and your community. They can play street soccer all they want - still not putting the best athletes on the US MNT.
Luis you never anwered my questions regarding Owen and Maradona etc. I actually spoke with someone at the USSF and they said that they are always driving up and down the streets of Chi town on their lunch breaks looking for young hispanic kids playing street soccer.
When they do find a game I'm told they will put the mandatory three hispanics..(see earlier post) on one the youth national teams.
I guess Mexico National coaches have to make petty excuses for you. Athleticism and Skill are different. I was being sarcastic STUPID. You think Athleticism is more important and I think Skill is more important. So why dont we base our opinions on actual facts and inteligent points?? Skill, FLAIR and SSELFICHNESS do not go hand in hand as well you FREAKING IDIOT. The original Dream Team had 2 White Players on it. Has this number improved considerably since?? Why is that ?? Oh I know. Because the Black community show more PASSION for the game. Therefore they produce the more skilled athlets for basketball in MAJORITY. I think you choose to miss the key word. MAJORITY. It's not about those 1-2 Great White Players. It's about the MAJORITY. So, based on this FACT, one must conclude that the race that shows the most passion for a sport is the one that prevails as the dominant sport. If in fact, every race were equally skilled or/and athletic then we would see a balance of ethnicities in FOOTBALL, BASKETBALL and Baseball. We do not, have not and will not. The more skilled prevail. They happen to come out of certain ethnicities that show more PASSION you FLAMING IDIOTS!!! Why would soccer be any different ?? Because of your wishful thinking ??
Gordon?
First of all, you are, as always, a lying sack of crap - the Texans team that tied the Mexican U20 team has the following names - Michael Klodzinski, Jacob Speed, Ryan Dendinger, JT Kotowski, Alec Petit, Taylor Curtis-Wheeler, Tony Pagano, Jack Blanton, Brody Hickey, Geoffrey Hill, Andre Reyes, Jeffrey Torda, Jaime Jasso, Barry Foster, Sylvester Contreras, Caleb Richardson, Joe Haines, Reis Woolley, Garrett Yancey, Kevin Wright, Ashkan Khosravi - maybe 3 hispanics? You suck at life and are a racist jag off. I never said athleticism was more important than skill you lying piece of garbage. Your point about basketball and passion again misses the point completely - if hispanics have more passion than the evil white people - fine - but that does not mean the US MNT are going to get the best athletes - it may mean they pick a few more hispanics but they will still get beaten by El Salvador because they are not the best athletes - the point is to get our best athletes to find that passion for the sport - are you really this stupid? Blacks dominate in basketball because they are more athlete and have a passion for the game. Try and keep up and stick to the point.
If black people just had passion for the game but were not the best athletes then the US would also get beat at basketball.
So now you are saying black people are better athletes than white and Hispanic people?? That's racist. So now you are saying that while USA will pick more Hispanics but they are not the best soccer players becausevthey are not the best athletes? So now you are generalizing by race, are you not, you hipocritical idiot?
I said I DOUBTED the Dallasteam had mostly non Hispanics. This is an honest assumption since Hispanic youth teams dominate those type of events, as well as ID2 Tryouts and are the most scouted in Illinois. Either way they did not beat a select team. Mexico is winning WORLD CUPS at the youth levels. AIt makes sense that the would use a tournament like that to look at more players. So by admitting that USA would also get beat at Basketball if black people were not the best athletes, you admit that white white people do not show the same passion, skill or athleticism, correct?
I never said white people were evil. I would hope al are not. There has been a history and tendency of abuse of power that have involved sports. Do not twist mywords you idiotic moron. Why would picking more Hispanics for USA soccer team mean we would not get the best athletes? I don't understand that. You are a RACIST but have tried to be political. Good try. Apparently our USA top Hispanic aathletes would not be good enough to beat El Salvadors top athletes, according to you. That's STUPID just like everything you say. USA is supposed to have a bigger budget than this small country for scouting, facilities, training, equipment, etc. Fact is we are getting the best non Hispanics who pick soccer first in USA to represent us . By your statements you now admit that black people are the best athletes for all sports in USA. You denied that earlier. Do you have a plan on how to get them to pick soccer first? Or are you just going to keep wishing they did? ?
Can't we all just get along?
I want topic the best athletes regardless of race and you want to have a majority hispanic US MNT. Who is the racist? You are what is wrong with face relations in this country. I feel sorry for the kids you influence.
I love Hispanics athletic non athletic fat thin smart dumb I love them all. I just love the word.
Gordon couldn't agree more!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! But are you okay with my three hispanic requirement?
Gordon, you are coward and a racist. That's a dangerous mix. Maradona, Pele, Messi, Cristiano, Neymar. The best as of late. All Latino. I want the best soccer players regardless of race as well. It is just hard to not notice who PLAYS, LOVES and is more PASSIONATE about soccer in Usa without it reflecting on USNMT. It is refreshing to see Mexican Scouts coming out to check our players out though. Ok, fell sorry for them when you read about them in Top Player headlines, STUUUPID. Sam, so what are your 2 cents?? What do you agree with and why ?? Gordon will not agree with you because he is all about picking the BEST ATHLETES for USA regardless of race or regardless if it happens to be entirely one race, like Hispanics for example, as long as they are the best soccer players available. Aint that right Gordon ??
Hey guys, Roy Hodgson the newly appointed England Manager was quoted as saying he is looking for the English hispanic Gascoigne. " I wll scour the back alleys and streets for the next English Hispanic Gazza"
Luis I think you not Gordo is the racist... which would you prefer a hispanic team that blows or a team of athletes all caucasion that wins?
I'm not a coward and if there was a way to prove that to you I can assure you I would. You are the racist. And worse you have no character or honor. You assume the Texans are mostly hispanic because you are blinded by your racism. Facts and truths don't matter you just jump to conclusions based on your limited education and racial bias. Worse you don't see it - you actually think someone that criticizes your point is racist - you actually think someone that wants to pick the best athletes REGARDLESS OF RACE is a racist - that makes you a complete and total moron and why, in our lifetime, there will always be racial issues because of low-life degenerates like you and Al Sharpton and I feel so sorry for those kids you are influencing to be victims and to hate white people - YOU ARE THE ONE THAT MADE IT ABOUT RACE. Try and think...I'l wait...okay...I simply made a point at the beginning of all of this that I don't think the US MNT gets the best athletes. NOTHING ABOUT RACE. You are the idiot that jumped on my comment immediately about the hispanic player - try and remember that you racist imbecile. You say the best players ever are hispanic but fail to acknowledge white non-hispanics that were great players - what about current players Rooney, what about Van Persie, what about Drogba, what about Ribery - who is the racist? You say I said at some point blacks were not good athletes - you are a lying sack of garbage. You can't accept truths - I mention the US MNT record against Mexico since 2000 and you cry like a baby and make an excuse about friendlies. I point out to you the solid number of hispanics and the hispanic coach for the U17 US team that got crushed and you cry like a baby and make excuses - 'well, there should have been 9 starters that were hispanic' - who is the racist? I say the Texans tied the Mexican U20 team and you cry like a baby and say 'well, the Texans were probably mostly hispanics' - who is the racist you freaking moron? Further you are so uneducated you don't understand the point - you think the US should go pick the players that are the most passionate about the sport and play in the streets BUT my point is it does not matter if they do if the best athletes aren't the ones doing that - we need the best athletes the US has to offer - black or white or hispanic or asian or whatever playing in the streets developing the passion to compete for the US MNT yet you continue to tell us that the hispanics are passionate and they should be picked - YOU ARE SO FREAKING STUPID - TRY AND UNDERSTAND THE POINT.
Sam I enjoy SOCCER. So you get the idea. I will not enjoy the Bayern vs Chelsea Final. Soccer lost in that competition. Bayern should kill Chelsea but Chelsea will probably defend with 11 at their 18.
No, i assumed and did jump to the conclusion that the Texans were mostly Hispanic because Texas Soccer Teams are largely Hispanic, especially the better ones. FACT. I am critisizing your points, Gordon, and you are calling me racist as well, are you not? Let me guess you live in the South and reenact the civil war every year. I SAID the best players in USA are Hispanic in Majority and I made a point as to why. THEY CHOOSE SOCCER FIRST. You chose to bring up a point about Marquez,not USA born, to counter. I was talking about HISPANIC AMERICANS. You made it about Mexicans. You brought up Marquez (Not American) and his CHARACTER and also brought up Barkley (American)as a positive candidate but stayed away from his character. Who is the Racist? You have used mainly black players as examples of top USA athletes. Where did I say otherwise stupid?? I highlighted many times how they dominate sports invented by the white man and how tuff they made it for them to get in pro sports. Rooney is GREAT. He is not American. Not the best example of Character, though. RACIST. Mexico vs USA. Who cares? My main point was and is that the best soccer players in USA ARE HISPANIC. USA. HISPANIC AMERICAN. COMPRENDE?? aGAIN, IF THAT WERE THE TOPIC, i DON'T THINK mEXICO IS WORRIED AT ALL ABOUT usa SINCE THEY ARE WINNING AT ALL YOUTH LEVELS & SENIOR at another level. Al Sharpton is a product of how his people were treated by your people. White people have a long way to go make up for what they did to those people as well as the American Indian. But that is another topic. What was the Solid # of Hispanics on that U17 team ? Were they the best Hispanic AThletes available?? Maybe not. USA Scouts are looking at the top club players mostly. I know because I am involved with this right now. Who's crying. The fact that Ispoke with a Mexico National Coach and recieved that info on what players were selected to U20's does not matter to you because you are racist. You would rather satisfy your racism with wishful thinking than accept facts, no matter the source. PETTY. USa should pick the players that love the sport and are best at it. This goes hand in hand 99% of the time. Basketball and Black People, Great Example. I understand your best Athletes Point. You are saying they are not Picking Soccer first. You are choosing to exclude the Hispanic American after admitting that they do pick soccer first. THEY ARE THE ONLY RACE PICKING SOCCER FIRST IN USA YOU IMBECILE. THEY HAVE GREAT ATHLETES AS WELL, YOU MORON. What you mean to say if you want to stay politically correct, like you have attempted to do at times, is that NOT ALL OF THE BEST ATHLETES ARE PICKING SOCCER FIRST and by this you mean all other races in USA excpet Hispanics. ALL I am saying is that this current fact should reflect on our USMNT until ALL OF THE OTHER BEST ATHLETES START PICKING SOCCER FIRST, YOU FREAKING IDIOT.
If you are a coach you are part of the reason College Soccer is unwatachable and is not producing top players. You help set the standard of what is beleived to be soccer in USA. I am willing to bet anything that I will develop more pros and national players than you. I am done here. I can't thank you enough for this material. Great refernece point. Stay tuned for more in other articles, my friend.
Wow you really are an idiot..i was trying to give you the benefit of the doubt but MORON you are!! College soccer not in the biz of producing pros. And if it is "unwatchable" then tell be dumbass why does FOX, BIG TEN and ESPN all regularly telecast games? I will answer that....because it gets ratings, thus making money. Forty five percent of all MLSers played college soccer. So not producing top players is incorrect. Clint Dempsey, Tab Ramos, Claudia Reyna, Onyewu, John Harkes. Some of the best the Us has ever produced and yes a couple of them Hispanic. And Argentinian national teamer Santiago Solari played division 3 college soccer.
See sasha cirovski interview below.
College soccer is not about player development, it’s about personal development. It’s a uniquely American experience and just because the rest of the world doesn’t have it doesn’t mean our experience is insignificant. The top college teams can go play against the top reserve teams of the same age of any teams in the world. Wake Forest went and played the Brazilian U-20 national team in Brazil and had a game of 4-3. My Maryland teams have gone to Europe and competed against the reserve teams in Holland, Germany, and England and have fared very well.
Anytime you measure anything you have to measure it by what happens at the top level. Eighty percent of our professional players played at the top 20% of the programs in this country. So, is it typical what happens at Maryland in the top 20 programs in the country? Absolutely. But don’t paint college soccer’s development by looking at what happens at 206 schools. Look at our top 20 programs. Any one of our top 20 teams and can compete against any reserve team in the world and can compete with professional teams in this country.
Sam, another dumbass. College is about dvelopment because it sets a standard of what is expected to get a college scholarship and play on a college team, stupid. Be fast, Physical and Strong first, Tecnical and Skilled later. The style of soccer is what is wrong and College soccer encourages it except for 1-2 of them. It has not evolved.
Gordon..Im out.... college soccer is American soccer.
YOU ARE A LIAR. You say - "I am done here." and you say earlier " I have to stop with this blog." Then you continue to post. LIAR.
YOU ARE A LYING SACK OF GARBAGE. You say - "I was talking about HISPANIC AMERICANS. You made it about Mexicans." BUT you said - "Mexico the opppsjte. We should learn from this country soccer wise and stop trying to come up with dumb excuses." and ""Mexican Americans are the best Soccer Athletes in USA." LIAR.
YOU ARE A RACIST PIECE OF GARBAGE. You say you won't watch Bayern vs Chelsea because you think teams that are not dominated by hispanics can't play skillful soccer.
LIAR. You say "You have used mainly black players as examples of top USA athletes." Have you not read me mention Drew Brees, John Eway, and many other white athletes? LYING SACK OF CRAP.
YOU ARE UNEDUCATED AND CAN'T UNDERSTAND SIMPLE CONCEPTS. You say "USa should pick the players that love the sport and are best at it" - my point was the best athletes are not choosing soccer and until they do we won't win on the men's side - it does not matter of they are choosing soccer first right now and are not the best athletes - they will lose. And you say "You are choosing to exclude the Hispanic American after admitting that they do pick soccer first" - YOU ARE A LIAR. I have said multiple times to pick the best athletes regardless of race - YOU ARE A LYING SACK OF RACE-BAITING CRAP.
LYING RACIST. You say "What you mean to say if you want to stay politically correct, like you have attempted to do at times, is that NOT ALL OF THE BEST ATHLETES ARE PICKING SOCCER FIRST and by this you mean all other races in USA excpet Hispanics. I have said, again, that I want all athletes regardless of race. YOU ARE A LIAR AND A RACE-MONGER.
IGNORANT UNEDUCATED RACIST. You talk about college soccer like you know it. But you don't. You are one of a million foreign people or people of foreign heritage that come to this country and to the soccer fields and think because you grew up with the game and played as a youth in the streets and because your dad made you watch the Mexican league games every sunday that you are an expert. Sam and I have been around people like you all of our lives. You are a joke. You don't have a college education. You did not attend college. You may not have even graduated high school. You did not play soccer at any high level. You played basketball. You have a 'D' license. You are an idiot if you think you know enough to comment on college soccer or anything else really. You are a self-proclaimed expert because you are foreign or of foreign heritage - that means nothing and you know nothing yet you seem to feel you can comment on college soccer even though you have never played it nor coached it - what an idiot. You started a club - great -that is the only way a foreign person with no degree can coach is club - you sell your great club with the ideology of being like no other club - LIAR -how do you know - have you coached at other clubs - I am sure not - that makes you a liar - I have seen your website and for you to criticize other clubs is juvenile and inappropriate - further your website talks about not being about winning and club success and then you list 13 club accomplishments -you are moron. You are a dime a dozen. You are a racist that has never bothered to take the hard road to success - you did not go to college, you have not coached much nor taken anything but entry level coaching courses yet you profess to know everything about college soccer and club soccer. You have no honor - you a liar. You have no knowledge yet you profess to and worse you criticize others.
AND ONE MORE THING YOU LYING DISHONEST LOSER - don't say "my friend." We aren't friends and never will be.
So amillion of my kind are a joke? Thx. More good reference. No, Gordon you and Sam are experts. Keep up the good work. I will do what i do. Let's see who gets the satisfaction at the end of our roads. You are really doing your homework on me. That's good to see. I have seen enough to know what is not right and what I am doing seems to be working. We win with 2 (mostly 0 subs)subs the most and always with 25-50% underage players. That's why our success is more than a simple tournament win. Enough said HOMIE. I guess I don't see the value of coaching beducation in USA like you do. Sorry. I love everyuone and especially you for this great reference you have given all of us. ADIOS AMIGO!!
Anyone can read between the lines of all your posts, you’re a self-proclaimed expert. A moneymaking soccer club phony who played park soccer and has no idea how to teach. Pedagogy is something you have no idea about. I personally am offended by the scores of "coaches" like you who I have come across who can't teach. I have to Google you now and then probably get more enraged.."your types are all that is bad about USA youth soccer". Gordon at first I though you where merciless but our country is littered with foreign club coaches in particular English who are in it for the buck. Is Luis one of these?
You lied again - "I am done here" and yet more posts, you can't even tell the truth about that - what a liar and a victim and a race-baiter and an uneducated fool - go ahead with your hispanic club soccer teams, go ahead with teaching kids how to 'work the system', go ahead criticizing college soccer and USSF coaching courses (even though you are going for your C) and white people and scouting and cry victim and go ahead and do that even though you never even went to college and never took the hard road and worked for an education nor took coaching courses - what a role model - a loser that just sat at home, did not educate himself and complains that it is all someone else's fault - poor little hispanic boy. Go ahead with your fantasy of a majority hispanic US MNT - they would get crushed just like the U17's did if they were not the best athletes and they might even throw the ball at someone or throw an elbow in an opponent's face. Adios bitch (although I am sure you will be back).
Until the next hispanic article.
Yea they would because all Hispanics do that kind of stuff. I can see why someone would throw an elbow at your racist face. I guess I will tell my kids ti stay way from Delwaware colleges. I ll tell you what lets do an experiment. I will show 10 of my white friends to read both of our comments and you show 10 of your Hispanic or black friends and lets see what they think of both of u as they will read
Another post after you said you were done? Shocking. Who would have thought you would have said you were going to do something and then not do it. How do you live with yourself? You probably are the type of uneducated club coach that would influence his players where to go to college based on their own personal feelings and bias. What a loser. I can't think of anything else more wrong with development in the US than you and sorry uneducated club coaches such as yourself. And your comment about the elbow just shows what you really think and what you likely are teaching your players - it is okay to throw an elbow if you think someone is racist - did you coach Marquez? We could do the experiment but you are not trustworthy enough for anyone to think you will do what you say - you are a liar and always have been and always will be - you think it is okay to say you are going to do something and not do it - you think it is okay to improperly influence your club players like a pimp or classless agent and you definitely think it okay to throw an elbow against the evil white racists. I have an experiment for you - why don't you check out the Mexican history with slavery - maybe you will find Mexicans had black slaves as well or maybe you will lie and cry about that being white propaganda or maybe you can't read being the uneducated, street-soccer playing, great 'F1' basketball player that you are.
No I will leave it up to them after reading this blogso they read between the lines and see how ignorantly biased an educated college soccer coach is thinking Hispanics were to blame for the U17 performance evn though the U20s and U23s didn't even get out of qualifiers. Based on those recent resuluts wouldn't you say they performed a little better than these 2 with a few more Hispanics on U17? No matter what your wishful thinking saids the facts and results say otherwise. What's worse racism or throwing elblows? Hmmm. So now we are comparing histories? Do you really want o go there? Did our race commit genocide on another? Did my race enslave and deny as much as possible their constitutional rights to another race? What do you think about Obama? I think you must have black friends close by and that's why your s Jared of voicing your true opinion on them. My kids are classier than any other club in Illinois. And you will get to see that on the national level. Obviously class and character Owes not go hand in hand. With a college education. Racism exists at all levels. You should get your team to read this blog. I know I will. Thx again. This was perfect example. Of the evil out there and what the national sentiment is towards Hispanics and what is socially tolerable to state. Great reference tool.
Great dispaly of advanced education Mr. Delaware Collegee Coach. Not to mention class. You are my friend. Only a true friend Wu prove all of my points. Thx again.
Gordon, What do you think your superiors would think of your posts on this blog ?? I don't want to get you fired. I will put together your most offensive comments and you do the same from me. That's a good test right there.
Gordon Racist or Not? You decide. Here are his comments.(Parentheses are my comments). If it helps satisfy you, I am sure JJ Berea would have made an exceptional att mid (PuertoRicans Dont pick soccer 1st). the fact that the US men's program does not get the best athletes - are you saying the Mexican American athletes are the best athletes in the US? Who is naive? I don't know the actual definition of Mexican American or hispanic or what we call someone who's parents and themselves were born in the US (American Americans?) but seems like we already have tried your way and this team won one game and was crushed by Germany(How did less Hispanics on U20 & U23 work out?) Well, honestly, there are some things I don't like about this and there are some things I don't like about the Mexican player (in general)- there does not seem to be as much of an emphasis on sporting behavior - Marquez's behavior in NY, Sanchez trying to trip Eddie Johnson after a goal, refusing to shake hands or exchange jerseys - I still believe in my original concept that we don't get the best athletes and, no, I don't think if we do they will be mostly hispanic. this is not Mexico - I like our sporting behavior, I like our fight
You said we should have majority of hispanics on the MNT and I simply addressed that and pointed out a negative aspect of that I thought in a pretty fair and true way. If you are not self-aware and cannot see your flaws then that is your problem to deal with - I realize it was a general statement but surely deep down you can admit that it is factor of the Mexican player and I don't want that as part of my country's national team.it should be our style - the American style - not your style, not the Mexican style, the American style (What Style is this?). You repeatedly referred to Mexico and the Mexican American player -you don't seem to care much about truth nor sporting behavior nor any character. Let's try this - I think the US MNT should be majority white. Because they are better soccer athletes. You want a team full of hispanic players and clearly would prefer them to be Mexican and you don't give a crap about sporting behavior. so you take your team full of Mexicans or hispanics and don't care about the sportsmanship
More posts - surprising - a man of true dishonor. So now you are criticizing me for calling you names and saying the thread has gotten too negative? What a joke - you're an idiot. Let me help you with the facts again....My first post was not directed to you nor had anything about race.....here I will paste it for you....."We are not getting the best athletes. The war is lost because the battles are taking place in the high schools where the best athletes are still playing football and basketball. You can take not the best athlete and dress them nicely and put them on an Academy team and train them with the US Soccer manual but if he comes up against the best athlete from El Salvador or England or wherever they are going to lose - it's men against boys."........then someone else responded and I replied....."Mike, everyone thinks we have these 'athletic' players but we really don't compared to the best of the best from other countries. Until we have 'Charles Barkley' in goal we are not going to make it. I agree the skill and sophistication needs to improve also and I think we get middle to upper class players that are not as hungry and coachable as others."...nothing offensive or attacking in that.....however, then your dumb provocative ass chimed in...."Gordon, I am tired of that bad excuse of the best athletes in Usa dont pick soccer first. The best athletrs in soccer usually come from Africa. The best soccer players come from Hispanic countries usually. The best soccer players prevail over the best athletes. Barkley? Do you think he would be effective at blpcking lower 90s? Come on man!! The best soccer players in usa are going to Hispanic countries to get the opportunity they are not getting here. Plain and simple. I gaurantee you that if we found a way to keep all those Hispanics that left to other countries we would not be in this situation. Gordpn if you were picking the best athletes according to your standards you would never even consider a Messi, Xavi, Etc. You are the problem. People that think like you are the ones in charge of youth soccer. Hence, the consequences.".....you addressed your comment directly at me and hurled the first insult with "you are the problem.".....ring a bell...now that you have the facts remember you attacked me first, I'm just shutting you the hell up so don't cry like a little baby if you can't take it, just crawl in a little corner and act like a victim.
You are one of a million foreign people or people of foreign heritage that come to this country and to the soccer fields and think because you grew up with the game and played as a youth in the streets and because your dad made you watch the Mexican league games every sunday that you are an expert. Sam and I have been around people like you all of our lives. You are a joke. You started a club - great -that is the only way a foreign person with no degree can coach is club - poor little hispanic boy. Go ahead with your fantasy of a majority hispanic US MNT - they would get crushed just like the U17's did if they were not the best athletes and they might even throw the ball at someone or throw an elbow in an opponent's face.
MORE LIES AND DECEIT. I did not blame the hispanics for the failure at the U17's you liar - you said the US was not picking hispanics and I proved you wrong and said it did not work because we did not pick the best athletes....you see, this is race-baiting....you have learned well from Al Sharpton.......How many hispanics do the U20's and U23's have? Does not really matter because my post was about our failure to compete at the top levels in the world and getting crushed the way we did by Germany at the U17's was embarrassing and now we are struggling at the CONCACAF level - more embarrassing....but I was curious and since I have to do all the fact checking to weed out your lies and deceit....the U20's had the following play in the game they were eliminated from - Hernandez, Orozco, Garza, Salgado, and they did not use Arreola - the U20's are now coached by Ramos - from Uruguay.....the U23's had Agudelo, Corona, and Villafana....both teams had players from all over German Americans, African Americans, etc......I would say decent representation - not enough for you of course, you want a full roster of Mexican Americans and that is your goal - don't be politically correct - admit it....They are all losing with hispanics and with inly a few hispanics BECAUSE THEY DONT GET THE BEST ATHLETES AMERICA HAS TO OFFER - they are picking the ones that grew up playing in the street in Mexico and in Germany and in Ghana and it still does not work...WAKE UP AMIGO.....oh and when did the US do the best at the youth level? Well for the U17's they finished 4th in 1999 - I am sure that team must have been loaded with hispanics, right? WRONG - they were led by Donovan, and Beasley, and Beckerman and Onyewu - they had pparently one hispanic....hey, moron, who did they beat in the quarters? Mexico....hmmmmmm.........How about the best result ever for the US U20 team....4th place in 1989....surely this team must have been loaded with hispanics, right? WRONG - they were led by Snow, and Henderson, and Keller (you've heard of him, right?) and Dayak - I don't see one hispanic on the team at all.....it seems if your point would be true the US teams would be getting better as we add more hispanics, right? Oh don't worry - I am sure you have an excuse already planned out - teams weren't as good back then, anyone could win, who knows what a race-baiter like you thinks of.
I am doing the opposite of hiding in a corner. As my website states I didnt even play soccer and I have undeniably been more effective than most TOP clubs around me at developing players. A coach is much more than someone who just played no matter the level. A coach is someone that brings the best out of you and motivates you to improve among many other things. The Scam in this country is paying a lot of money to guys that played at a higher level without first checking to see how many top players they have honestly developed. It's all about who you are and not what you have done presently. I have not lied about anything I have done and should have went to college but made a bad decision in my life. That is why I am coaching to make sure kids like me don't make the same mistakes and know how to better handle situations in this country with intelligence and class. I think I have the solution to our debate. Lets keep race out of it for now. What is your defintion of a great soccer player and athletic attributes that help him be an outstanding soccer player ?? Please don't just say "They are the Best AThletes". Be specific. There are many shapes and sizes of great athletes but in Basketball they are usually taller, in football they are usually stronger, Marathon runners have more stamina, etc.
So now you are saying if Mexico had slaves it was okay because they did not have as many as America? Great retort (that means comeback, response). My point was you always point out the negative in others - mostly the evil white Americans but never can say anything bad about your own race and never think Mexico can do anything wrong....this is race-baiting ignorance. Did Mexico have an oppressive dictator? Did the US? When did Mexico get a democracy? Do you know? No, all you know is evil white people had slaves and killed indians....race-baiter. And now you are saying class and character are not what college coaches pick? Is this from your experience as a college player - oh, wait - you did not go to college so how do you make this outrageously stupid and race-baiting comment? Because you are a race-baiter and stupid. And your website - "Coach Luis believes and teaches his young players something that has been overlooked in American Soccer : Loyalty, Comradery, Honor." Your kids 'are classier than any other club in Illinois"??? Really, so you have been to all other clubs and seen them on a day to day basis? of course not. That makes you a liar and someone who speaks out of ignorance. So no Americans have ever taught values such as loyalty and honor - YOU ARE AN IDIOT AND A RACE-BAITER and you are teaching your kids the same. Why are you here in this country if you hate it so much?
"As my website states I didnt even play soccer and I have undeniably been more effective than most TOP clubs around me at developing players." Are you sure? You see this is where the lines get blurred for you. Your website does not really state that - it says you played basketball but does not say you did not play soccer - see the difference - there is subtle deceit in everything you say. How do you know you have developed players more efficiently? Are you saying you have developed more players than the Magic and Eclipse? Seriously? At one level you are charging $975 and Grove United is charging $1000 - really? This is your big difference?
"I didnt even play soccer" says it all.........
How do you know we didn't pick the best athletes for U17's ?? By repeating this so many times will you somehow get everybody who is picking football and basketball to pick soccer first in your lifetime?? Do you think Argentina, Spain and Germany are saying " well if we had the best athletes picking basketball over soccer we would beat USA" ?? That's sounds really stupid. They seem to be getting better at Basketball by rapidly catching up to USA while still remaining as top Soccer World PowerHouses, dont you think??
Gordon, why state the obvious? Look at any website for any soccer club and the first sentence always states how many years they played pro or college. ALWAYS. Never how many players each coach developed and if they do it never specifies how many years they were there. That usually measures how much they will get paid along with the level A,B or C license. I get certified only as needed. Yes I am saying that. I don't know much about Eclipse but Magic defenitely. Great example. WHo have Magic developed ?? Elijah was with Magic for 1 year before he was noticed. 3 of their top U13's were with me for 3 years. 4 of their top U12's were also with me for 3+ years. 1 of my U10s best player there. Now they have all declined amnd some came back. I am only comparing since I started my club to present. That is also obvious if not stated. You would think a college grad would get that much. All of these clubs play 7-8 months of the year with 2 outdoor and 1 indoor practice and 8-10 games. We play 12 months for same price, 2-3 outdoor and 2 indoor practices with 20-30 games a season. You do not see the inmense difference, STUPID ?? That alone is probably the secret to my success so far. I am not greedy. Shhh. Dont tell anyone. It does say it all. How terrible of a system do we have in place that a successful College Coach argues PETTY SH T about soccer with a BASKETBALL GUY and makes ignorant points ?? My goal right now is to become a College Coach just to rub it in even more.
Gordon, you clearly said "we tried having more Hispanics yet it did not work". Didn't that team do better than the the lesser Hispanic teams U20 & U23? Were you expecting a World Cup Win ? By those measures it's the improvement is quite obvious. Whats more embarrassing ? Making the World Cup but losing to Germany or Not qualifying by losing to Guatemala and Canada and tying with El Salvador?? You lost that one my friend.
GORDON !! WE ARE NOT GETTING THE BEST HISPANIC AMERICAN ATHLETES TO REPRESENT US!! THEY ARE GOING TO OTHER COUNTRIES WHO RECRUIT THEM FIRST!! Mexico in no way came close to the atrocities committed in the USA. You can more easily compare USA back then to the NAZI Regime than Mexico. USA is an oppressive Dictator to the rest of the world. Just ask the entire world. I have been in other clubs. Magic. I am currently with a white club and it is very well run but would not trade for mine. My kids just get to play more and under different styles. I may not agree with but they must learn every angle. I didnt say others didnt teach those things. I said it is overlooked by many going with wins first, club first philosophy. This does not go well with Loyalty, Comradery STUPID. I am in this country to help others overcome obstacles and people like you. I don't hate you or this country. There are few things I hate. You make me laugh. Why would I hate you?? I don't agree with the history of HIPOCRACY in this country and the present day BULL. I am doing my part to make this a better country. YOU'RE WELCOME!!
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - I saw the U17 game vs Germany and it was men against boys just as it is when Blaz Perez plays against Steve Cherundulo and I know this because I actually played the game. Argentina and Spain are probably saying that they could have used Pique or Casillas on the courts and I am sure Colichinni would have done well also. No you idiot I don't think by repeating this the US will start to get the best athletes - as I said, the battle is being lost in the high schools. "I get certified only as needed" - what a joke. I went to the Magic site and it was pure class - no degrading other clubs like you do - you are a classless, dishonest race-baiter. You have no stats to back up your claim of developing more players during your club's existence - you just say it because you have no problem if you are wrong. Wonder why your players leave you to go to the Magic? Hmmmmm. Of course you say they decline - what else is a egomaniacal liar like you going to say? Obviously they get better training with Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola than they are with a guy who is a technical director with USSF and has a A license. But, wait, you played in the streets and are from Mexico so you know more.....what a joke.
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - you have to be educated to become a college coach, sorry amigo.
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - did you read the post about past youth successes -best were in 1989 and 1999 with no or one hispanic - those teams made it to the semi-finals. Making it out of the group and getting crushed by Germany because we don't have the best athletes is not improving. Try and educate yourself on the meaning of words.
Luis "I get certified only as needed" Arreola - we aren't getting the best athletes because they are choosing other sports not because we are losing hispanics to other countries - are you really that stupid and blinded by your racial animosity (that means hate)? My point was not who has a worse past - US or Mexico - but the fact you never mention anything bad about Mexico - you say how awful the evil white Americans are but then fail to mention Mexico also had slaves and still have issues with blacks. It is called race-baiting and deceit. Alright, now get out your dictionary - saying "overlooked" is the same as saying they do not teach those values - come on, really? You must be joking and not really this stupid? How old are you, really? It is a lie based on no proof - that is what you and Al Sharpton do - remember Tawana Brawley?
I did not argue your point of Germany killing us, Stupid. But if you want to compare with the recent U20 and U23 with the amount of Hispanics on each then the U17s had the better results and they just so happen to have more Hispanics Mr. College Coach. I also wonder they come back. Like I said before I am comparing to what I have seen. I have not seen how the USSF director coaches but have heard good things from him. I am talking about U8-U14 where the development most matters. How many hispanics did you see on the Magic Teams Gordon ?? What would you say the ratio was ?? What is a top soccer player to you ?? Is that a question you wish not answer ?? Are you too busy looking me up ?? How PETTY.
When it comes to Academies like Magic at the younger ages U8-U14 I question the development strategy of over rostering, constant player to team rotation, constant top team player demotion(Mid Year), constant unethical recruitment. Why is an Academy development stage so similar to none Academies?? It is very clear they are selling a brand of winning and not developing even though they might say differently. I don't know about Academy at U15+ but it's younger ages do not make it look good. You probably see the same but won't say it because you might have to ask for a job there some time. More and More people are wising up to this. I thought you appreciated Honesty. I don't believe in the licensing system. It's a money maker. For someone who hates non soccer knowledgable people making money off of soccer you sure do defend the system alot.
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - all the youth teams did not do well - the only ones that have were in 1989 and 1999 with few if any hispanics you blind fool. Maybe they come back because they can't make it or they are afraid of challenge - kind of like you and college - you teach them to be adversarial to the white man - some will use that as an excuse not to try. It is hard to try and make legitimate points with you since you lie and distort the truth and you will just call me a racist no matter what I say - the answer about the top soccer player is multi-faceted by position - much too complicated for you. Your complaints are typical of someone that does not know what they are talking about or have never been involved in a club they are criticizing. That is the typical criticism of youth soccer in every part of the world - too much emphasis on winning and not enough on development. I have not coached club for some time nor have I seen a top level club up close day to day so hard for me to say. I don't, however, think competition is a bad thing otherwise we create a bunch of players with a sense of entitlement - I think there can be a club that provides development and is competitive - they do not have to be separate. The problem is you state publicly problems with other clubs without really knowing - that is dishonest and unethical....think about it. The list of alumni from the Magic is impressive so I am sure they are developing players - their list is at http://www.chicagomagic.net/page/show/306937-alumni. Yet you criticize them even though you only "get certified only as needed" and call it a money maker - that is typical excuse of someone who is lazy or afraid and just won't accept the challenge to better himself. Tell you what, let's try and experiment - go get your licenses, go work with a top club and then come back and tell everyone what you think but stop right now talking out of ignorance - it isn't pretty and it isn't ethical. And I am not defending the system just pointing out your flaws - there are many flaws - one is the emphasis on club and not high schools where we lose the best athletes.
Now you are getting personal talking about my players. Just shows the type of person you are college and all. When you come over to watch the Magic again let me know so you can say that in my face. It will be a short conversation Sunshine. Hard for you to say? You are saying. I was involved. I just told you that you Idiot. Great answer on the Best Athletes. Something you have been debating in this entire blog but won't go into detail. That's probably because you will look even dumber trying to explain that point. Argentina, Germany and Spain. Are their best Athletes evenly spread out in basketball and Soccer?? What an idiot. APparently I did not miss out too much on college. Let me find out where you went to college to stay away from there. They didn't teach you any character or proffessionalism. Later ESE!!
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - is that a threat? What are you going to do? Throw a ball at me or cheap shot me with an elbow? Trust me, you would not want to meet me. You are saying I should take something you say for its word? You are a lying sack of garbage that I would not trust if you were the last hispanic on earth. You lie about everything. You asked about top soccer players not best athletes you lying ignorant fool and you obviously cannot take part in a reasonable conversation - for example, if I say top soccer players must be disciplined and tough you would say 'racist! All you want is rigid white people and not short hispanics that are technical' - you are too stupid and uneducated and biased to have a decent conversation with - you have proven that. Try and remember, maybe make a note or two, you can't get into college - you have to be educated and accept challenges to do that and you can't go to college because the evil white people will be there - they might even teach that Mexico had slaves - that would be too much for you.
Pedagogy....set induction....socratic method...teaching methods. These are all things foriegn phoneys know nothing of.
That's a cool name. Thx. All Mexicans are like Rafa. So yes. Can't elaborate or detail on you're only argument, Huh? Ok, give a defenition for both. Best Soccer Athlete & Best Soccer Player. That shouldn't be too hard for a College Grad who argues with uneducated people that did not play soccer about soccer. I think I will get you fired after all. I would rather meet though. So the evil in USA compare's with Mexico's huh? How about the Holocoust ? WOw, you are educated !!
Luis you make no sense at all. Really. Do you atleast have a huge penis?
Luis "I get certified only as needed" Arreola - let's see if you have any dignity - when did I say the US atrocities compared with Mexicos and did I ever clarify that for you? And when and where did I say I "can't" eloborate on my argument?
And knowing who I am dealing with - look up the word 'compare' before you answer.
What point are you trying to make about Mexico? What does it have to do with racism in sports in USA? Still nothing on what it is you so passionately think the best athlete for soccer is, huh?? Ok College VRAD. That saids it all. Its easier to talk about Mexico and Rafa, right? Lol. What an iidiot
What about the penis question?
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - As I thought no dignity, no honor - can't even back up for comments. You are a loser with no education, no knowledge, and spouts off about things you have never been a part of or know anything about - that is called ignorance.
Just like I thought. Nothing Behind your points. All that education and nothing to show for it. Arguing senseless nonsense with an uneducated. Non soccer guy. This country is full of coaches like you that talk about an American style and not having the best athletes and like you can't elaborate on that thought because its all nonsense and a poor excuse. Time will prove me right and you an educated idiot.
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - I asked you a simple two questions to see if you could tell the truth and display integrity and you could not - you are a liar and a man of little character and a racist, race-baiting imbecile. The only thing you have ever offered of any truth is that you are an 'uneducated non soccer guy.'
I elaborated on every point I made. You did not. Who is the coward? Hipocrit. Rants on Marquez. All that education. College soccer sucks. You are the reason. You contribute to the. Uncreative style USA PLAYERS display. Great Job COLLEGE GRAD.
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - you do understand English, right? I know that means you would have to do some white people things so maybe you don't. You said I compared Mexico and US atrocities and you said I could not make points for my arguement - both are bald-faced lies - but I tried to give you the opportunity to back up your comments and you could not - that confirms you as a race-baiting liar who never played the game yet think he knows the solution to the US MNT problems. You say college soccer sux but you were too much of a coward to attend and you say I don't contribute to creativity in players even though you have never seen me coach - don't you see what a complete moron that makes you? Oh wait, you are ignorant.
Well Gordon, it seems I am prejudging you based on your ignorant comments. Are you not judging me without truly knowing me? You went as far as ignorantly labeling my players as well showing how great of an education you did receive. What did I not elaborate on as far s my strongest points. Stop crying and ask me any question you would like answered. Lets do 2 at a time and you will thouroughly answer mine as well that you have so conveniently ignored and get this over with. We do not have to agree. Lets just elaborate on our thoughts. You're strongest point was we Dp not have the best athletes, correct? What in your opinion is a top soccer athlete? Simple questions.
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - its not my job to repeat my questions - go back a few posts and re-read it.
Mr. College Coach/ Athlete Scout"Everything great about USA soccer" Hayes, I thought so Bitch.
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - not sure what you mean with that illiterate rambling but I didn't think you would be able to go back and back up your lies - you have no fortitude, no courage to admit your failures and lies and even this rambling is a lie - why don't we try again - go back and see if you can find where I DID criticize the USA soccer and then come back and post that you lied.
Bla, bla, bla. WHAT IS YOU'RE DEFENTION OF TOP USA ATHLETES FOR SOCCER??
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - Prove you are not a liar or admit to it.
Waa waa waa, sniff sniff. ???
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - Can't do it - so you are okay with telling me I have never criticized the US team and 'compared' the US and Mexico atrocities inferring they were equal and that I have stated I 'can't' elaborate on my argument?
Athlete????s
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - just so I am clear, you are admitting that you lied and that you are not going to back up your statements?
Atletas??
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - so you are a liar and seem to have no problem with it. Okay - we are agreed on that and you need to work on integrity issues. The problem is you are a person that spouts off about what you know nothing about - you never really played the game, you never played college soccer, you know really nothing of the entire selection process of US Soccer yet you get on this forum and espouse that the US team should be majority hispanic - and lets be honest you want it to be majority Mexican American. It is called ignorance. You think by virtue of your ethnicity you know more about the game than paid professionals with decades of experience. That is called ignorance and racism. You now want me to ignore your lies and deceit and get on here and tell you what I think a good athlete is. You have missed the entire point. That is called stupidity. What difference does it make? Speed, strength agility, quickness. Does that help? The point I have made all along is the US MNT does not get the best athletes, period. You think the best 'soccer athlete' (whatever that is) are currently hispanics. That is not the point and stupid to bring up because it does not address my issue. Picking the best hispanics because they have a passion for the game is not going to solve the problem no matter how racist or blind you are - it won't solve the problem. So my advice is, first, don't be an asshole and respond to my post the way you did and apologize and do remember you started all of this in a negative way. Admit you are a liar and have lied many times in this forum. Admit you are biased and a race-baiter. Admit you really have no idea what you are talking about. Go and reflect on everything, go get some more licenses, go educate yourself and then come back and apologize.
Wow!! What a great defenition of Athlete!! That College education really paid off, College Coach. You see Mr. College, in general, Basketball players , football players, baseball players and soccer players all have certain key athletic capabilities that differentiate them, you freakin IDiot. olojuwan and Nash consider themselves soccer players first but perhaps were better suited for Basketball even though they come from Soccer first countries. What mostly every top athlete has in common is that they come from a communtiy or culture where the particular sport is an integral part of them or where it is picked first. You can see this everywhere. If there is a Blas perez in Panama there surely are a few in USA. He is a top athlete from a country that picked soccer first. In USA there is a rather large Hispanic Community that picks soccer first. Why isn't it reflected the same way?? What good does it do you to have a college education if you can't elaborate on you're only point ?? The Best Athletes.
Saying "oh, if we had the best athletes" is mediocre and makes little sense. How is that better than saying "let's concentrate on the ones that do pick soccer first" ?? You don't like to hear this because you are bias. You would rather make excuses and wish for something that is unrealistic. Who needs an education to figure this much out ?? When you state that we are not getting the best athletes picking soccer first, are you generalizing ? Do you not realize or want to acknowledge that a great % of USA is picking soccer first ?? No, you are too busy bringing up Marquez as to why Hispanics should not be picked or not as amny. Character was a subject that you brought up as far as tendencies. Bad Character is an equal disadvantage as proven in every ethnicity and is pointless to bring up but shows what little argument you had against my points. Let's not mirror Marquez, Barkley, Kobe, Rush or McEnroe when selecting character. Let's look to the ones that are picking soccer first while still hoping the ones that haven't and still don't some day will. Maybe by doing this we will excite them and get everything going. Just like Basketball. remember??
You're only point makes no sense after you admit that Hispanics generally do pick soccer first in USA. That's over 16% of the USA population and growing at a faster rate than any other ethnicity here. Are you stating that the remaining 83% are the better athletes? Well this only means that we are not getting the best athletes in any of the sports in USA. Hispanics are not picking basketball first in USA or else we would have a better dream team. Same with football and golf. Do ykh not see how stupid you're point is? Bottom line is the American ethnicityd picking a sport first is the always dominating one. Every sport in USA shows this to be true. Black people are only about 14% of the USA population and they dominate 90% of the NBA. I rest my case College Boy. Those are called facts that back up a theory. Not senseless bullshit with zero substance. We are really in trouble if you are picking the scholarships. In GEBERAL.
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - you really are an idiot and a liar. You say my reason for not picking hispanics was all because of my point about Marquez?? Are you really okay with being that stupid and that much a blatant liar? I would tell you to go find where I said that but you have no integrity and are a lying sack of crap so it does not matter. I said I have a problem with hispanics in general with lack of sporting behavior and I stand by that - if you can't admit to that then you are an unaware racist moron - oh wait, we have already established that. If you really think the US MNT is going to improve by picking just from the hispanic population that picks soccer first then you continue to show your ignorance - we need to pick the best athletes from all races so we have the best athletes in AMERICA - not just the best athletes from hispanics. Don't forget the U17's - crushed with majority hispanics and an hispanic coach - don't cry and make excuses - I know you can't handle certain things.
Luis "I didn't even play soccer Arreola - did you really say Nash comes from a country that picks soccer first? Wow - as much as you are jealous of white people and white people with college educations and as much as you were a coward to even try maybe you should have tried a class or two before you make such idiotic statements that shows your illiteracy and profound stupidity. I guess according to your philosophy the NBA should be all Chinese - don't they pick basketball first? Major League baseball should be all defected Cubans because they choose baseball first?
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - its okay if you didn't go to college and have trouble reading and writing things and understanding concepts - it is obvious you are jealous of those white people that did. Seriously, try and accept you are a lying sack of nothing that is just a useless parent coach that has no education, no soccer education, no real experience with the game and that you are a racist who spouts off about something he knows nothing about or never has had the courage to experience.
You ignore my poinsettias because you are the coward but I will address you're cowardly lies. U17s were not majority Hispanics. Do you know what majority means? College coach. They did however perform at a higher level than the ones with less Hispanics. U20 & U23s in same year. Again you're cowardly lies and points work against you. U17s were the only ones to make it to international stage. You kind of prove my point with you're ignorant statement.
So you stand by your statement of the Hispanics sporting behavior bringing up one example in Marquez and choosing to ignore Usas sporting behavior in all other ethicities in national competition? What's your point? That Hispanics are more prone to negative sporting behavior or the only ones capable of such? Its ok to say this even though there are plenty of negative examples of other USA races? Its ok to say this even though it has nothing to do with Hispanics USA where you have Bo such examples? YOU IDIOT. Why don't we point t that out? There are no negative examples of bad sporting behavior in Hispanics in national competition but there are plenty with black and white people. Again your only stupid points work against you. You should stand by something that makes sense.
You want me to admit to something that everyone I. USA is guilty of as a race?? Ok. We all are guilty of
Eating, sleeping, etc. Are you sure you went to college? Major? The Chinese pick basketball first? Hispanics Diane they show for it all over the world including USA and dominate. You can't see that because you are racist. Tell you what. Lets see
Who develops more national players first? Then maybe you and Morocco.ric people like you will see its nit about you're coaching courses but about how well you motivate the majority of you're. And take the time to help them improve. Not hoping to or picking the fastest biggest athletes. Lets make abet. This is my prediction. In less than 5 years USA will have to select majority Hispanic for most of its teams since it will turn to a publisized controversy as ti why so many leave to other countries.
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - most of your rambling are tough to decipher due to your illiteracy but these are almost unreadable - seriously, take one or two classes somewhere to help you out - I know you won't because that would be doing things the American way. It is tough to keep going back and repeating things for you but since you are maybe the dumbest person I have ever communicated with I will have to - the best the US ever did at the U17 or youth levels there was one or zero Hispanics on the team - it was Donovan and Keller, etc - sorry you lose - the U 17's with many Hispanics and a Hispanic coach got crushed and exited early. If our best efforts were without Hispanic influence why would we want more Hispanics? I have brought up other examples of poor sporting behavior with hispanics and you know this you lying sack of garbage - I have also played against and coached against Hispanic players my whole life - I thought you wanted me to be honest and not politically correct? Guess you can't handle it and you will just cry racism and play the victim - you are good at that. For the hundredth time - I point this out countering your comment you freaking moronic uneducated imbecile. The point about controversy is maybe the dumbest thing you have said yet and that makes that the dumbest comment anyone has ever said - you are a racist ignorant fool with no experience - if you hate America and Americans and white people and big fast strong athletes I have a solution for you - go home and cheer on Marquez.
You're true colors are coming out. The comparison with U17s was with the the rest of nationals in same year you IDIOT. But if you want want to do historically then we will be back in a few yeas when the inevitable will happen. Check out this years U14. I told you so. You lose. By the way, Brent Shea Shea assauting a ref. Now that los truly dispicable. Should we assume that all white people have this tendency? No that would be as stupid as assuming all Hispanics are like Marques. As far as who displays more unsportsmanship on a regular basis, I have encountered much more racism in the white player and parents than anyone else. I believe this happens much too regularly and seems to be tolerable our local leagues. But what doesn't kills us makes us stronger. Greatest example. The black athlete in USA. Why don't I go back home? I am home stupid. I a am related to my American Indian brothers that were almost exterminated but we Wi even out those numbers again. You will probabaly have to go back to you're country somewhere in Europe which is a long commute. I will help improve the American way which I don't agree with on many levels. Youcare just another one of those racists hat wants to justify you're ignorance with political B.S. You have already lost.
Luis 'I didn't even play soccer" Areola - we are talking about solutions for the US MNT you idiot so we have to look at the history of the youth teams - PLEASE take a class, one class, muster some courage to try and help you understand simple concepts. Did I explain when I first brought up about hispanic sporting behavior about Sanchez and not exchanging jerseys and Marquez and praised Hernandez and explained I was speaking in general and not about all hispanics? Yes, I did but you are such a blind racist fool you just lie to help you get your race-baiting points across. I agree racism amongst whites is a trait for whites - does that help if I admit this? Can you now admit sporting behavior, discipline is a problem amongst hispanics? Probably not because you never played the game, you know nothing about the game, you are just some uneducated parent that speaks out of ignorance. I thought you were born in Mexico - guess not but that is the home of the small, skilled soccer player where they pick soccer first - just seems like you might be happier there.
Solutions. Exactly. So why are we talking about the past STUPID? The present results are what matter. Are you saying that there was a better development startegy back then? Or were more of the TOP Athletes interested in soccer back then ?? None of you're points coincide with each other and you went to college?? So what is you're point exactl when you bring up Hernandez as far as sporting behavior of Hispanics? Which one is it? Bad or Good Sporting Behavior ?? Because there are examples of both that you are pointing out. If you want to see the good in people "IN General" then you look at good examples mostly. Same with the bad. You brought up 2 different examples but look to be more inclined to generalize Hispanics as having bad sporting behavior in general. That is just STUPID. But when talking about solutions for our USA team we must conclude that all races involved have plenty of good and bad examples as far sporting behavior on any level. That is why this is a pointless subject you freaking IDDIOT. But let's entertain you're ignorant thoughts. Let's see. Whats worse? Racism or not trading shirts ?? You are a huge idiot if you think it's even close. You're points again work against you. To generalize we should take examples of Hispanic Americans and not fromother countries. I did not say we should bring in Mexicans and nationalize them to represent us STUPID. Should we generalize African Americans because of the negative actions of teams/players from Africa ?? Don't you see how stupid this is?? You thinking I should go back to Mexico is common amongst you're type of people. Last I checked there are plenty of tall Hispanics coming out of USA playing pro as well as Mexico's new U17, U20 and U23 teams. I don't think USA teams are that much taller. I will check. I am 6'2" stud. My son is 5'11" and just turned 13. You lose again.
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - so it is okay to talk about the Indians and past racist behavior towards blacks but not the past of soccer teams? You are such a fool. I guess we won't bring up how the US is 10-5-2 against Mexico either. Go back and read (if possible) and you can see my thoughts on Hernandez. I also said I have played against hispanics all my life and coached against them - maybe you should make notes as you try and read these things so you can remember points instead of babbling on. NOW TRY AND FOLLOW - YOU SAID WE SHOULD EMULATE MEXICO - REMEMBER???? THEN I MADE THE COMMENT ABOUT SPORTING BEHAVIOR - ANYTHING RINGING A BELL??? It is pointless if you cannot admit to a general area of improvement of your own race like I did - that is due to your blind race-baiting jealousy. You are jealous of the white American and it shows. If you don't want any criticisms from YOUR points then just shut the hell up and don't make ignorant comments.
The winning record for USA would be a good point if we were talking about that. We are not. This was you're counter to me saying we should learn from this country development wise as the presently show to be doing an outstanding job with U17s, U20s, U23s. The key word there is "Presently" you freaking moron. You brought up tendencies in Mexicans with stupido examples and I countered with the atrocities commited by white people to show you that if you go that route you will lose every time. It's pointless. We should try and change. The negatives and see the good in people and ld with example. The guys with he education like yourself show the most ignorance to regularly. You want me to admit to a flaw that every race is guilty of?? Thats is stupid. At least ask that I admit to something that only difertiates us Hispanics you idiot. What college did you go to?. We should emulate their player developmebt strategy you freakiking iiotic hillbilly. Nothing else. Can you handle that? By the way Klins called up 8 out of 27 players who were Hispanoc. Are we going to lose npw? How about U14s ? More than 1/2 are ahispanic? Gee, I wonder who said this would hapen sooner or layer. YOU LOSE.y.
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - the spelling is getting worse and worse but I will try and use my education to decipher your illiterate meaning. So, according to your philosophy, Brazil who has won multiple World Cups 'in the past' should not be learned from as we are focusing on the present....hmmm....you are a genius. I see you can't do it with hispanic flaws - too much of a racist - I guess there are none - the hispanic player is perfect - no general flaws.....hmmmm. The poor sporting behavior and lack of discipline does differentiate hispanics you moron but you can't see it because you are blinded by your jealousy and racism. Yes, we are going to lose - like the U17's - like Mexico to the US in the 2002 World Cup - shoot Mexico even lost to the US in the U23's Olympic qualification....hmmmm....maybe we should look to a different country to emulate.
My spelling could be due to me limited education or it could possibly be due to me using a small phone to type you idiot. Brazil has always dominated. Past and present you MORON. Therefore, of course we should defenitlely look to them as well. England would be a better example according to my philosophy. They have done nothing for quite some time now to present day even though they were once dominant. There is nothing to learn from them presently. Some Hispanics do have discipline problems, I never said otherwise, as do some white and black people. My problem with you're examples is that you are using non Americans to prove you're point. Correct me if I am wrong but don't black pro players get in trouble all the time with dog fighting, gun and drug posession, etc. ?? Phelps=drugs, Rothlisbergur=Sexual Assault. These are American examples of poor discipline. These facts don't seem to have an influence as to selection of these players in USA. I don't see anyone saying we should select less black people for our Nation Basketball team because some black people do stupid things. Is Phelps going to stop representing USA in another swimming competition because he smokes weed ?? I doubt it. I am certain there are many more negative examples in white and black Americans than there are in Hispanic Americans. Therefore, it is pointless and stupid. You insist on this widely general trait(black,white, brown) because you have no other argument. It is sad to see how ignorant a college grad chooses to be when it comes to racism. USA beat Mexico in a friendly with U23s in preperation for Olympics you dumbass. Mexico won it all when it mattered. USA lost to Canada and tied El Salvador when it mattered. Next. Emulate player development from any country you choose that has shown greta player development at the moment like Mexico. Like Germany. Mexico is much closer. I can't say this enough. You are not a true American. You should be rooting for our usnmt regardless of the color of their skin and remain positive. I know I will. I can't say this enough. I TOLD YOU SO.
nOBODY IS PERFECT, you idiot. Everybody have flaws. Some flaws, like the one you pointed out are general in all races. Some are more skilled at certain things than others. Some are more passionate than others at certain things. Some live a sport in their blood and is part of their culture unlike others. Facts. Not racism. Facts. The obvious always comes out on top. Is Kilns wrong in his selection of players and coaching staff ?? YOU LOSE!!
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - Brazil not dong as well as they have in the past - I am sure you do know that but maybe you don't since you are just a clueless soccer dad - according to you we should not look to them to emulate. Now try and follow along - Luis makes point - 'we should emulate MEXICO' - Gordon counters and says why he has a problem with that - presents it in a fair and general way - Luis cries and sobs and cries racism and victimization. You can't admit that hispanics (which includes Mexico - not sure if you knew that) - have a problem, in general, with discipline and sporting behavior same as whites have problems with racism and blacks have problems with crimes - these are generalizations but you can't accept it about your own race - you see that is the problem with a man who has no education and no self-awareness - he is immature and can only do one thing - cry, call it racism, and play the victim. It does not mean I think we should pick less hispanics I simply made a retort to your point - I have always maintained we should pick the best athletes regardless of race but certainly sporting behavior should be part of the selection process but my guess is you don't think so because you don't care about that which illustrates my point - you probably love Marquez. More crying about friendlies - more excuses, poor, poor Luis. US beat Mexico when it mattered the most - in the World Cup.
Brazil is always the team to beat. USA has never matched their lowest point. No matter how bad they do they develop the best. You are truly a stupid man. I did admit that Everybody has shown to have bad sporting behavior. You just want me to say that only Hispanics do even though you admit that white people have shown racism till this day. I don't know about you but making racist remarks about you're opponents is much more an example of bad Sporting behavior then not trading shirts. Hispanics are not perfect.but so isn't anybody else. What's you're point stupid? If we are worried about sporting behavior on usnmt then there is no difference amk get races in USA. It comes down to skill like in any other sport and it is starting to show. I this.k you should take up your moronic argument with Klins or Perez and make sure you point out Marquez because it doesn't seem they know about it. YOH LOSE AMIGO
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - So now you are saying we should look to the past so I guess you agree that the best the US has done at the youth levels were with Donovan and Keller, etc. and with one or no hispanics - okay, gotcha. Okay, you can't do it - you can't admit general flaws in hispanics - is there anything in general hispanic players have as a flaw? I'm not telling you to say only hispanics display poor sportsmanship you idiot - do you know what 'in general' means? Probably not so look it up and then get back to me. Pity you can't even admit one single flaw IN GENERAL of the hispanic player but, in the end, it just shows your bias and your racist attitude. In the end, you want the US MNT to pick their players from the hispanic population - 16%-18% of the population - and you think they are the best "soccer athletes" (whatever that is) as they choose soccer first and play in the streets and you want them all to be Mexican Americans - your goal is to have a US MNT to be all 18-22 players as Mexican Americans. And I think that will never happen and I think if it does we will still get beat by the better soccer-playing nations as they send the best athletes as selected from 100% of their nation (not 16%) and, yes, I would be concerned about sporting behavior - in other words, I would never want Rafa Marquez or any hispanic (or any race) like him to represent the US - no matter if they were natural US citizens or became citizens or how good they were (this distinguishes us a bit). I want the US to get the best athletes to pick soccer and to play in the streets and we aren't getting them and we won't by picking from 16%-18% of the population. Hopefully, I have summarized things accurately. As for you - you are a typical person of foreign background that ONLY by virtue of that background believes he knows everything there is to know about soccer even though he never really has done anything within the game - never really played it, only been a youth parent coach, never been in college, never been involved with US Soccer YET you feel comfortable making negative comments to me and others that state their own opinion on this forum - you have many problems - ignorance, bias, racism, race-baiting victimhood - my advice is to go educate yourself - take more courses, try and see yourself and your race from other perspectives and open your mind and never, ever spout off about things you really don't know anything about - then, and only then can you win anything.
Didnt say that stupid. What I said is that Brazil's standard is so high that what would be great for us is not so good for them. They are undoubtebly a top 10 soccer country at their worst you moron. Past or present. Everyone has flaws of sportsmanship in General. Therefore, pointless to target one. Give me examples of Hispanic Americans and not Mexicans you racist idiot. The biggest subject here is more "Hispanic Americans " on the usnmt. You can't or refuse to differentiate, you redneck idiot. 16-18% of the population but more than 50% of the soccer players and about 75% of the Elite players. The Magic in Illinois won almost every age group in Illinois State Cup. They are at least 85% hispanics on every team. Same in California and Texas. The Top soccer states. Why wouldnt it happen ?? It already is but we have yet to see it full blown at the national level. Why would we get beat?? Whats your reasoning behind that? Our National Basketball team is basically picked from 14% of the population you dumbass and they are the best in the world. How do you explain this? El Salvador has a population much smaller than our 16% and actually pick many players from our 16%. That saids it all. Marquez is Mexican you IDIOT. That's great that we should not pick bad characters. No Barkleys, Limbaughs, Rodmans, etc. Agreed. Why is that still your topic?? That has nothing to do with my point of picking the ones that are passionate about the game STUPID. We have different opinions of what the best soccer players should be. Granted. Fact is your best athletes will never pick soccer first but if they do will not be for a very long time so why continue to make mediocre excuses ?? Fact is that countries like Spain and Argentina seem to have their athletes evenly or close to evenly spread out in Soccer, Basketball, Tennis, etc. proving your point completely wrong. I have established many times I don't know everything about soccer. Very few in USA know much about soccer. What is funny to me is how people like you can be in the positions you are making it extremely easy for people like me to show you up. I have already won. My only mission with USA soccer was to prove how naive and arrogant the development mentality is in USA by doing it better. I have already done this and will continue to do so. You will be reading about me and my players soon enough. AFter that, I might be taking you're job. Hey, Bradley, a basketball guy made it as usnmt coach. Why not me??
That 14% of USA's population also dominate Football and Olympics and are pretty good at Baseball as well.
Why aren't we picking more from the other 86% for these sports that Black people dominate ?? Could it be that we are not as passionate?? Why aren't we picking the more fundamentally sound white players for the NBA or the NBT?? They are more than 50% of the population and Athletic, aren't they ? Only 10% of the National Basketball team. Surely we should not be dominating according to you.
I was very generous with the 10% by the way.
Luis "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - Let's see if I understand - it is okay to look at the past for Brazil even though they are not doing as well lately but not okay to look at the past for US youth teams even though they are not doing well lately -hmmmm - interesting. I guess though now you have changed your point (again) we can look to Italy to emulate because they have always done well but not so much lately - hard to keep up with your flip-flopping -OH WAIT - we can't emulate Italy because they are not hispanic!!! Oh, my bad. You make a point about emulating Mexico as we are talking about them and the US and hispanics and I make a point countering that specifically about some Mexican players but also talking in general about hispanics but you still don't acknowledge we were discussing both - hmmmm - you are smart- why would I need to point out poor sporting behavior by hispanic americans if you said we should emulate Mexico - hmmmm - you are a genius. It is over - you cannot point out any general flaws in hispanics or hispanic americans that makes you the biggest horse's ass on the planet and the most blind race-baiter out there - I guess the hispanic player is perfect and has no flaw - I guess blacks do not have a general flaw of committing crimes and whites don't have a general flaw of racism - I tried to admit to my race's own flaws to help you but you can't do it - HISPANICS ARE PERFECT - MEXICANS, HISPANIC AMERICANS - all of them - glad you can have a reasonable conversation.
You are such an ignorant lying moron - your facts and percentages are undoubtedly incorrect but you throw them out there like they are fact - do you have any proof? Of course not - what has that ever mattered to you- you are a man full of deceit and you never can back anything up- 75% of elite players - you are full of crap - I did some fact-checking and just the one team I looked at - the Texans had only a few hispanics - this is the team that tied the Mexican U20 team - OH WAIT - that was not the full team, cry, sob, tears, more excuses - you are such a victim - can you prove any of your stats?? OF COURSE NOT - you are a blind, biased lying sack of garbage. 50% of all players - you are an idiot - prove it Mr. Basketball. The subject here is the best athletes on the US MNT - don't try and turn it to your subject you racist idiot - YOU responded to my comment - you can't even tell the truth about that. And just because I know you are such a lying piece of crap and because I believe in facts - I went to the Magic website and randomly selected the U16 pre-Academy team and pulled up a photo of the team - they do not have a roster but based on looks alone I would say 4 of the 14 players are hispanic - could be more I know but just wanted to check your 85% supposed fact - man, you are a lying sack of crap - what do you say about that?? What excuse do you have? You said every team was at least 85% hispanic - you didn't say 'your guess' or anything you stated it as fact and I picked one team, one high level team and it proves that YOU ARE A LIAR AND YOU WILL SAY OR DO ANYTHING TO ADVANCE YOUR BIASED RACIST CAUSE OF A MEXICAN AMERICAN US MNT - YOU ARE A LIAR LUIS - ADMIT IT. Then you go on to say same in CA and TX - obviously more lies - I picked the one team in Texas and found the opposite - you base your information on ignorance - THIS IS THE WHOLE PROBLEM.
Blacks are, in general, our best athletes you idiot AND they are passionate about the sport. Hispanics, in general, are not our best athletes. Your point about why are we discussing the issue of picking our best athletes when that will never happen WAS MY ORIGINAL POINT - I did not say it will happen it was just a point about why we aren't going to be successful until it happens - REMEMBER I MADE A POINT FIRST - don't try and ignore that fact and spin it to your point of view - I know you like to forget things and distort facts and lie and speak out of ignorance. and now you are saying the best athletes don't pick soccer in Argentina and Spain? What a moron - obviously some great athletes choose other sports but the majority of their best athletes choose soccer - are you serious with that comment? "Very few in USA know much about soccer." THIS IS YOUR PROBLEM - prove this? You can't but you still spout it out as if it were fact - don't you see? You don't know that, you only assume it because you are from Mexico and only by virtue of that do you assume Americans know nothing about soccer - YOU ARE A TOTAL MORON AND THAT IS A RACIST COMMENT - do you tell your club's parents this - do you tell the club you work for this? My guess is no because you are a coward but you probably tell your club this because that is your reverse racist club - probably only have hispanics involved. WHAT A RACIST. SHOW ME SOME FACTS ON YOUR IGNORANT COMMENT. Your comments about showing me up are laughable and racist and your comment "My only mission with USA soccer was to prove how naive and arrogant the development mentality is in USA by doing it better." proves what your aspirations are and how jealous you are of Americans - what are you basing your comments about being naive and arrogant on? Facts? Of course not - maybe 1-2 club teams you watched with your son? That is your basis for condemning the entire US coaching and club population and why not throw in college coaches as well - have you ever even seen a college training session? YOU ARE A LIAR. Since I know your name, maybe your club parents and maybe the club you also coach at would like to know your true feelings....hmmmm. Bradley, a basketball guy??? More lies. Maybe he played in high school but that is nothing - maybe something for guys like you but nothing for the real world - he played soccer at Princeton and yet you call him a basketball guy - now if he had played basketball and not soccer in high school and then quit basketball, even after many 'FI' offers, then he would be a basketball guy I guess - a loser is more like it. and try and remember you can't coach in college if you are an uneducated fool.
No Stupid, Brazil is still presently a top 10 soccer powerhouse development wise. Their past is just a plus you IDIOt. Try to keep up College Boy. When did I say to not look at USA's past?? You can if you want but if you are make a point out of it. The question was do you think they had better development strategies back then than they do now? Did you experiment with alot of drugs in college or what ?? As far as Mexico, all I said was we should emulate their player development because of their results at every youth level. I said nothing of emulating their sporting behavior. POINTLESS. I never said don't pick Whites and Blacks because of their sporting behavior either. Also pointless. I am talking only about skill and player development. If you want to take up the importance of sporting behavior on USA teams we should take a hard look at "ALL AMERICANS IN GENERAL" first then pinpoint certain aspects of ceertain races and see which one is more detremental to the national teams.
How is the fact that the Mexico U20 team did not have it's starters?? Doesn't it only make logical sense, given their recent results for U17, U20 and U23's ?? Maybe that Texas team should represent the USA in Olympic Qualifiers, right?? Wow you are STUUUPID. So you're facts are based on one Texas team?? Mine are based on 3 entire states and you are more credible ?? Ok, sure. So now you are picking one team and proving me wrong. What an idiot. Tell you what. Go to the Magic Website again and look at the top 10 Nationally ranked teams they have (U16's are not one of them). The U13's(#3 in the country), U14's(Top 5-10) and U15's(Top 10). Also look at the U12's while you're there. You can also see thiose pictures on IYSA.org. The #1 ranked team in the Nation at U13 is Pateadores, from California. Check them out sunshine. I will just continue to bring up top country teams. Let's see who wins. And we are only 16%. Can you imagine if we were 50%. I can because it will soon happen.
So finally, you admit that Black people are you're best athletes. Now let's evaluate why?? They are only 14% of population. What are they doing differently?? Why doesn't Africa have the best Basketball teams as well if they are the same race?? Why don't we have the best Hispanic Athletes in USa for soccer if there are in other countries of the same race?? My point is it will happen just not with what you speculate is our best athlete. No doubt we will have a couple great black soccer players but it's not in their culture. Now let's look at white people. They are truly more passionate about basketball, football, baseball, golf than they are about soccer yet they are less than 10% of basketball national teams. Why is this ? They are the great majority in this country. You say the best Athletes don't pick soccer first in USA and this is why we don't succeed. Now pay close attention here STUPID. Argentina and Spain seem to have enough great athletes to play BOTH, soccer AND basketball. Think about it. These 2 countries are USA's closest competition in Basketball and they are no longer getting blown out by them and have even beaten them. This clearly states that Hispanics are in fact athletic enough to compete with anyone. And according to you they pick soccer first, the best athletes. Meanwhile where are the white basketball players?? I am not being racist. I just believe the biggest difference is the passion of a sport which prevails in the black and Hispanic communities when it comes to basketball and soccer. Very few people know much about soccer in USA. This is how I know. I didn't play and I am developing much better players at a faster rate than many of the top clubs in Illinois. Simple. My club knows exactly my feelings and love me. Maybe you're college needs to know how you feel about Hispanics in general. If you can generalize Hispanics in USA as poor in sporting behavior then why couldn't I generalize all of USA soccer?? Have you been around the entire country and played against every or most Hispanics to make you're generalization, you idiot ?? I am done. You rant and cry like a bitch and argue with someone that is uneducated and didn't play soccer. This just proves how mediocre you are. Do you consider yourself a good example of USA soccer's best ?? I know that if I went to college and was a college soccer coach I would not lower myself to argue with someone like myself. You prove every single one of my points without knowing it. That is how ignorant a racist bigot can be even with the highest of educations. Look at U14's. i told you so ese.
Luis "Very few in USA know much about soccer" & "I didn't even play soccer" Arreola - must be easy to lie like you do, be proven a liar and then just ignore that fact. "I am done." Is that a fact this time or are you lying again. "When did I say to not look at USA's past?" Try this - "So why are we talking about the past STUPID? The present results are what matter." Are you saying you did not say that? YOU ARE A LIAR. "As far as Mexico, all I said was we should emulate their player development" - MORE LIES. You said "Mexico the opppsjte. We should learn from this country soccer wise and stop trying to come up with dumb excuses." You did not say player development specifically - YOU ARE A LIAR. You stated, "They are at least 85% hispanics on every team." Talking about the Magic - did you say that or not? You said "every team." YOU ARE A LYING SACK OF CRAP AND YOU CAN'T ADMIT IT. I picked that one team and it proved you were a liar and you can't even admit it. You have no guts, no humility, no courage - a lot like Marquez and proves why there should be less people like you involved with soccer in the US.